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09:51:05","會議時間":"2024-03-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查113年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於行政院主管：行政院國家發展基金、離島建設基金、花東地區永續發展基金及促進轉型正義基金。(詢答)\n二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展委員會及所屬主管預算凍結案等7案。\n【3月25日及27日二天一次會】）","gazette":{"lineno":249,"blocks":[["謝委員衣鳯：（9時42分）主席好，我想要請國發會龔主委。"],["主席：請龔主委。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：謝委員早安。"],["謝委員衣鳯：龔主委早安。我剛才聽到前面幾位委員都提到了，就是國發基金裡面收益這麼好，大都來自於半導體的貢獻嘛！"],["龔主任委員明鑫：一部分。"],["謝委員衣鳯：對。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：大概60%。"],["謝委員衣鳯：60%還是一部分？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：60%左右。"],["謝委員衣鳯：已經超過一半。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：台積電的部分大概占60%。"],["謝委員衣鳯：你看到聯合報的報導指出，半導體在討論要投資蓋核能發電廠，其實我們就看到了，對於臺灣經濟貢獻大部分裡面的半導體產業在這一次的電價調漲也是相對被調漲大的，對於半導體產業而言，他們也有一個在全球的綠色供應鏈上面對於綠能甚至有一些是RE100或者是低碳能源相關的需求，他們就希望可以有核能發電這樣子的方式，你的看法呢？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：報告委員，RE100主要是綠電，現在綠電的要求是全世界都需要，所以我們就是在綠能產業的發展上儘量來做、儘量來支持，除了太陽能光電跟離岸風電之外，現在也有新型態的，可能地熱或其他可能的……"],["謝委員衣鳯：可是我上禮拜好像有問過，我去環境部的時候，能源局局長說地熱的發展不可能，你知道占比不可能超過多少嗎？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：是，那個就等於是下一階段嘛！現在當然也有人講說臺灣的地熱蘊藏量非常豐富啊！這個就還是要做探勘，但總是要嘗試啦！"],["謝委員衣鳯：對。"],["龔主任委員明鑫：但是我要跟您報告的是，至少到目前為止，現在的核能發展方式還沒有被歸為綠能，所以……"],["謝委員衣鳯：我知道，現在還不是綠能，但是它是低碳能源，是不是？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：但是如果把核廢料又加進來的話，它一直沒有辦法被歸類為綠能，主要就是因為它有核廢料，核廢料是有污染的，所以沒有辦法被歸類……"],["謝委員衣鳯：我說的是因為還有一個是減碳的部分嘛！因為我們長期用的是火力發電，不管是燃煤或者是燃氣都是比較高碳的能源。你看到全球的電力能源結構裡面，高碳能源是60.4%、低碳能源是39.6%，但是我們臺灣的高碳能源是81%、低碳能源是16%左右，跟全球的結構是相違背的，所以很多國家在為了要求減碳的部分，他們也不得不重新考慮發展核能，這個部分國發會有沒有做相關的研究？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：至少從2050年淨零目標的規劃，目前是沒有啦！因為我們規劃……"],["謝委員衣鳯：因為你是減碳辦公室的執行長，是不是？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：是，就是永續會的執行長，所以我們目前的規劃還是……因為現在如果說要沒有污染的核能，那就要走到核融合，但是科技跟技術能力還要很久，所以我們不能期待說那個部分放在2050年來做我們的可能目標，但我們儘量來做，如果將來核融合的技術發展得很好，我們也樂觀其成，我們當然一定會來考慮使用啊！"],["謝委員衣鳯：對，去年COP的結論裡面有22個國家，他們也是重新再討論是不是要把核能……就是我們在核電的發展上面，當然去年沒有缺電的問題，可是今年不一定啊！今年的經濟成長，我們的預期都是百分之三點多，代表在經濟成長可能會增加的情況下，我們的用電需求會不會增加？如果在今年度用電需求增加的情況下，就有可能導致缺電的問題，以目前我們的發電結構來看的話，會不會導致未來台電的虧損更加劇烈？我們知道有可能以巴衝突造成石油上漲的問題，這都是未知數嘛，對不對？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：報告委員，我稍微釐清一下，就是COP28的22國不是COP的共識決啦！"],["謝委員衣鳯：我知道，就是有人提出啦！"],["龔主任委員明鑫：對，真正的共識決是現在到2030年的時候，綠能裝置可以是現在的三倍，效率可以達到一倍，這個目標我們是希望盡力可以達成，我們現在綠能占的比重大概是十幾趴，將來希望可以達到三十幾趴。"],["謝委員衣鳯：但是其實還有一個問題是在於，如果我們可用的土地都用來做為光電的裝置，那對於可能是效率的問題也好，或者是光電設施到底是不是嫌惡設施，它太接近民宅，當然上禮拜我也問過能源局，他說他們會做綠地、綠廊的相關規劃等等，如果太接近民宅的時候，會不會造成外面熱，他們裡面是涼的？但是會不會造成其他民宅的相關影響？這對於民眾都是一個非常重大的考驗，所以我們在推廣綠能上面來講，的確就面臨到瓶頸了，是不是？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：報告委員，如果是對於環境的影響，我想包括環境部、農業部、經濟部都會去考慮，民眾當然也會有一些……但現在有一個作法，我們現在的積極作法就是讓它的轉換效率可以快速地提升，因為以早期來講，轉換效率只有百分之十幾，現在慢慢隨著科技的進步，已經可以超過30%了。"],["謝委員衣鳯：你說轉換效率是指光電的轉換效率嗎？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：對，光電的轉換效率，如果它可以達到30%……"],["謝委員衣鳯：光電的轉換效率是在於太陽能光電板嗎？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：材料的部分，或者是新材料的發展。"],["謝委員衣鳯：對，可是問題是，如果以一般的民間，我認為台電也許可以做到，因為台電比較具備願意發展綠能，然後也符合國家的規章，可是對於一般的光電業者，他們只是賺錢啦！"],["龔主任委員明鑫：沒有、沒有，會啦！"],["謝委員衣鳯：他們會不會採用相關的高效率太陽能板？"],["龔主任委員明鑫：會啊！一定，因為法規上也會做一些要求啦！因為同樣的，你看，它如果效率提高三倍的話，那麼實施面積就可以少三倍，所以對臺灣來講是非常重要，我們在科研的這個經費上是大力地支持這方面。"],["謝委員衣鳯：主委，我還是跟你提出，第一個，我們在綠電的發展上面，即便是我們現在加緊腳步了，過去這幾年我們加緊腳步了，但是還是沒有辦法符合我們期待的綠電規則，然後未來經濟的成長，如果在超乎預期的情況下，有可能對於電力穩定的問題也會產生影響，這一次的電價調漲，對於民眾來說、對於整個物價來講，又產生了大部分的影響，因為所有的工業用電如果漲價，就會轉嫁到民生上面，即便在我們民生用電沒有漲的情況下，也會轉嫁到食、衣、住、行、外食等等，大部分的人都是倚賴外食，現在自己回家煮飯的人少了嘛，在這個情況下，對於民眾的痛苦指數，我相信會日益地增加，我覺得行政院應該要考量這個部分。謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝謝衣鳯委員。","接下來我們請鄭天財委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":242,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-19-5","speakers":["邱議瑩","邱志偉","張啓楷","謝衣鳯","鄭天財Sra 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對不對"},{"start":307.961,"end":308.802,"text":"二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關"},{"start":337.861,"end":339.802,"text":"二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展基金及所屬主管預算凍結案"},{"start":368.201,"end":390.528,"text":"如果太接近民宅的時候會不會造成外面熱他們裡面是涼的但是會不會造成其他民宅的這樣子相關的影響那這都對於民眾是一個非常重大的考驗所以我們在推廣綠能的上面來講的確就面臨到瓶頸了是不是"},{"start":391.048,"end":409.449,"text":"包委員如果對於環境的影響我想包括環境部、農業部、經濟部他們都會去考慮了那民眾當然也會有一些但現在有一個做法就是說我們現在積極的做法就是說讓他的這個轉換效率可以快速的提升因為早期來講轉換效率只有百分之十幾"},{"start":410.229,"end":411.97,"text":"二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展基金及所屬主管預算凍結案"},{"start":425.835,"end":427.617,"text":"二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展委員會及所屬主管預算凍結案"},{"start":446.852,"end":448.753,"text":"二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展基金及所屬主管預算凍結案"},{"start":466.684,"end":470.547,"text":"二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展基金及所屬主管預算凍結案二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展基金及所屬主管預算凍結案"},{"start":494.104,"end":499.288,"text":"二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展委員會及所屬主管預算凍結案二、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關國家發展委員會及所屬主管預算凍結案"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:31.750000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:34.051000+08:00","text":"主席好，我想要請國發會龔主委。","quality":0.769},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:34.051000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:35.051000+08:00","text":"請龔主委。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:34.531000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:34.991000+08:00","text":"謝委員早安。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:43.453000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:43.613000+08:00","text":"龔主委早安。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:44.233000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:55.216000+08:00","text":"我剛才聽到前面幾位委員都提到了，就是國發基金裡面收益這麼好，大都來自於半導體的貢獻嘛！","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:55.216000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:55.476000+08:00","text":"一部分。對。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:56.757000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:56.897000+08:00","text":"大概60%。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:58.975000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:59.236000+08:00","text":"60%還是一部分？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:59.336000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:59.436000+08:00","text":"60%左右。","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:42:59.576000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:42:59.876000+08:00","text":"已經超過一半。","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:43:00.097000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:43:00.637000+08:00","text":"台積電的部分大概占60%。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:43:07.252000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:43:55.737000+08:00","text":"你看到聯合報的報導指出，半導體在討論要投資蓋核能發電廠，其實我們就看到了，對於臺灣經濟貢獻大部分裡面的半導體產業在這一次的電價調漲也是相對被調漲大的，對於半導體產業而言，他們也有一個在全球的綠色供應鏈上面對於綠能甚至有一些是RE100或者是低碳能源相關的需求，他們就希望可以有核能發電這樣子的方式，你的看法呢？","quality":0.507},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:43:56.886000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:44:14.060000+08:00","text":"報告委員，RE100主要是綠電，現在綠電的要求是全世界都需要，所以我們就是在綠能產業的發展上儘量來做、儘量來支持，除了太陽能光電跟離岸風電之外，現在也有新型態的，可能地熱或其他可能的……","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:44:14.801000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:44:25.149000+08:00","text":"可是我上禮拜好像有問過，我去環境部的時候，能源局局長說地熱的發展不可能，你知道占比不可能超過多少嗎？","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:44:25.149000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:44:35.726667+08:00","text":"是，那個就等於是下一階段嘛！","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:44:35.726667+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:44:46.304333+08:00","text":"現在當然也有人講說臺灣的地熱蘊藏量非常豐富啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:44:46.304333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:44:56.882000+08:00","text":"這個就還是要做探勘，但總是要嘗試啦！對。","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:44:56.882000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:45:07.459667+08:00","text":"但是我要跟您報告的是，至少到目前為止，現在的核能發展方式還沒有被歸為綠能，所以……","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:45:07.459667+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:45:18.037333+08:00","text":"我知道，現在還不是綠能，但是它是低碳能源，是不是？","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:45:18.037333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:45:28.615000+08:00","text":"但是如果把核廢料又加進來的話，它一直沒有辦法被歸類為綠能，主要就是因為它有核廢料，核廢料是有污染的，所以沒有辦法被歸類……","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:45:28.615000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:45:39.192667+08:00","text":"我說的是因為還有一個是減碳的部分嘛！","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:45:39.192667+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:45:49.770333+08:00","text":"因為我們長期用的是火力發電，不管是燃煤或者是燃氣都是比較高碳的能源。","quality":0.031},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:45:49.770333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:46:00.348000+08:00","text":"你看到全球的電力能源結構裡面，高碳能源是60.4%、低碳能源是39.6%，但是我們臺灣的高碳能源是81%、低碳能源是16%左右，跟全球的結構是相違背的，所以很多國家在為了要求減碳的部分，他們也不得不重新考慮發展核能，這個部分國發會有沒有做相關的研究？","quality":0.038},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:46:00.348000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:46:10.925667+08:00","text":"至少從2050年淨零目標的規劃，目前是沒有啦！","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:46:10.925667+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:46:21.503333+08:00","text":"因為我們規劃……","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:46:21.503333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:46:32.081000+08:00","text":"因為你是減碳辦公室的執行長，是不是？","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:46:32.081000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:46:42.658667+08:00","text":"是，就是永續會的執行長，所以我們目前的規劃還是……因為現在如果說要沒有污染的核能，那就要走到核融合，但是科技跟技術能力還要很久，所以我們不能期待說那個部分放在2050年來做我們的可能目標，但我們儘量來做，如果將來核融合的技術發展得很好，我們也樂觀其成，我們當然一定會來考慮使用啊！","quality":0.008},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:46:42.658667+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:46:53.236333+08:00","text":"對，去年COP的結論裡面有22個國家，他們也是重新再討論是不是要把核能……就是我們在核電的發展上面，當然去年沒有缺電的問題，可是今年不一定啊！","quality":0.097},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:46:53.236333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:47:03.814000+08:00","text":"今年的經濟成長，我們的預期都是百分之三點多，代表在經濟成長可能會增加的情況下，我們的用電需求會不會增加？","quality":0.062},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:47:03.814000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:47:16.998000+08:00","text":"如果在今年度用電需求增加的情況下，就有可能導致缺電的問題，以目前我們的發電結構來看的話，會不會導致未來台電的虧損更加劇烈？","quality":0.965},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:47:17.578000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:47:25.081000+08:00","text":"我們知道有可能以巴衝突造成石油上漲的問題，這都是未知數嘛，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:47:25.081000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:47:41.986500+08:00","text":"報告委員，我稍微釐清一下，就是COP28的22國不是COP的共識決啦！","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:47:41.986500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:47:58.892000+08:00","text":"我知道，就是有人提出啦！","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:47:58.892000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:48:15.797500+08:00","text":"對，真正的共識決是現在到2030年的時候，綠能裝置可以是現在的三倍，效率可以達到一倍，這個目標我們是希望盡力可以達成，我們現在綠能占的比重大概是十幾趴，將來希望可以達到三十幾趴。","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:48:15.797500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:48:32.703000+08:00","text":"但是其實還有一個問題是在於，如果我們可用的土地都用來做為光電的裝置，那對於可能是效率的問題也好，或者是光電設施到底是不是嫌惡設施，它太接近民宅，當然上禮拜我也問過能源局，他說他們會做綠地、綠廊的相關規劃等等，如果太接近民宅的時候，會不會造成外面熱，他們裡面是涼的？","quality":0.223},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:48:32.703000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:48:37.805000+08:00","text":"但是會不會造成其他民宅的相關影響？","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:48:38.385000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:48:48.508000+08:00","text":"這對於民眾都是一個非常重大的考驗，所以我們在推廣綠能上面來講，的確就面臨到瓶頸了，是不是？","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:48:49.248000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:07.449000+08:00","text":"報告委員，如果是對於環境的影響，我想包括環境部、農業部、經濟部都會去考慮，民眾當然也會有一些……但現在有一個作法，我們現在的積極作法就是讓它的轉換效率可以快速地提升，因為以早期來講，轉換效率只有百分之十幾，現在慢慢隨著科技的進步，已經可以超過30%了。","quality":0.748},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:07.949000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:12.520429+08:00","text":"你說轉換效率是指光電的轉換效率嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:12.820429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:17.391857+08:00","text":"對，光電的轉換效率，如果它可以達到30%……","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:17.691857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:22.549000+08:00","text":"光電的轉換效率是在於太陽能光電板嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:22.849000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:26.849000+08:00","text":"材料的部分，或者是新材料的發展。","quality":0.071},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:27.149000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:46.291857+08:00","text":"對，可是問題是，如果以一般的民間，我認為台電也許可以做到，因為台電比較具備願意發展綠能，然後也符合國家的規章，可是對於一般的光電業者，他們只是賺錢啦！","quality":0.03},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:46.591857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:48.306143+08:00","text":"沒有、沒有，會啦！","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:48.606143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:54.034714+08:00","text":"他們會不會採用相關的高效率太陽能板？會啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:54.334714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:49:58.620429+08:00","text":"一定，因為法規上也會做一些要求啦！","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔主任委員明鑫","start":"2024-03-25T09:49:58.920429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:50:16.634714+08:00","text":"因為同樣的，你看，它如果效率提高三倍的話，那麼實施面積就可以少三倍，所以對臺灣來講是非常重要，我們在科研的這個經費上是大力地支持這方面。","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2024-03-25T09:50:16.934714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:51:28.649000+08:00","text":"主委，我還是跟你提出，第一個，我們在綠電的發展上面，即便是我們現在加緊腳步了，過去這幾年我們加緊腳步了，但是還是沒有辦法符合我們期待的綠電規則，然後未來經濟的成長，如果在超乎預期的情況下，有可能對於電力穩定的問題也會產生影響，這一次的電價調漲，對於民眾來說、對於整個物價來講，又產生了大部分的影響，因為所有的工業用電如果漲價，就會轉嫁到民生上面，即便在我們民生用電沒有漲的情況下，也會轉嫁到食、衣、住、行、外食等等，大部分的人都是倚賴外食，現在自己回家煮飯的人少了嘛，在這個情況下，對於民眾的痛苦指數，我相信會日益地增加，我覺得行政院應該要考量這個部分。謝謝。","quality":0.016},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-03-25T09:51:28.949000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:51:30.949000+08:00","text":"謝謝謝衣鳯委員。","quality":0.286},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2024-03-25T09:51:31.249000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2024-03-25T09:51:34.963286+08:00","text":"接下來我們請鄭天財委員發言。","quality":0.231}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}