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委員好我們在12月初的時候看到一個新聞就是札幌的核電廠它的防護牆被"},{"start":49.599,"end":68.904,"text":"就破口了那整個烏克蘭的715億的核災設施有破口出現的時候那國際原子能總署就警告輻射外洩恐失控那這邊是一個叫防護牆那針對這個議題最重要的是核安衛視掌管核子核電廠的安全那我們大家就想問的是說那我們的"},{"start":70.845,"end":86.793,"text":"核電廠有沒有這樣子的一個防護牆然後還有就是說我關於核電廠的安全設計有沒有針對國際能源總署他所提到的核實 暫時核安指引或有沒有外部威脅的評估的一個要求這件請組長"},{"start":91.116,"end":109.423,"text":"報告委員就是委員所問的就是針對IAEA最新的這些暫時的指引跟外部威脅這些重大評估目前就是台電公司都已經訂了核電廠面臨軍事威脅下確保核安的準備跟應變計畫以及相關的程序書那也透過每年的演習做一個檢討精進"},{"start":110.663,"end":120.748,"text":"所以 我們的台電有這樣的一個計畫書嘛 對不對有在演習嘛 對不對那這部分是不是可以北本席或是你們已經放在台電已經放在他的官網上面了嗎"},{"start":122.754,"end":144.16,"text":"有知道這些事情嗎報告委員因為有些內容因為是涉及保安的部分所以它是屬於比較機敏的但是它在演練的時候我們的都會派員去做一個視察檢視好那我當然講詳細這是你們河岸會知道嘛對不對是好那這邊我特別想問到就是這後面的如果可以的話我希望說給本席一份這樣子有沒有機會"},{"start":146.616,"end":168.249,"text":"還是就是還有說核子安全的設施等等好那如果沒關係我們看到我是想問的是他是否這樣的一個指南裡面啦計畫書裡面是否有已經針對無人機的攻擊還有飛彈的落彈還有長時間斷電的這個設計基準外的這樣的事件有沒有這樣子的一個內容包括這些內容"},{"start":169.561,"end":188.493,"text":"報告委員有的 像委員所提的無人機攻擊也是近年非常重視的一個議題那每年也都有進行演練好 那這樣子就會涉及到更重要的問題老師我們已經針對了國際原子能總署最重要的最新的這樣的一個趨勢已經因應到像5.23陣下面的無人機的攻擊"},{"start":189.093,"end":213.527,"text":"那在下面的問句再下來就是在說那我們在8月20號的時候呢核三廠考察的時候台電的許永慧副總他有回應到現場的質疑說核三廠有完整的安全性不只是原始設計的抗震是0.4G還已經加上了所有極端風險機率性的考量因此呢台電的許副總他認為說核安會呢"},{"start":215.808,"end":232.669,"text":"所說的加固到1.384G呢是考量到所有安全性風險機率的抗爭能力並非只是抵抗單純的地震喔這是非常重要 因為是何安威是做這個把關的那請問主委或者是高斌組長請問一下除一中的機組 扯三的"},{"start":233.47,"end":246.457,"text":"核二的 乾式儲存的設施在是否已經納入暫時防護情境是否在國軍戰略跟民防單位有計畫的銜接保障核電在極端風險下仍然是安全的"},{"start":248.678,"end":262.914,"text":"報告委員,因為我們台灣的柑橱設施系統其實都引進於美國NRC核准的系統那開發商當時在設計的時候有些柑橱甚至是實際上採用飛機撞擊去做測試"},{"start":266.932,"end":284.563,"text":"所以這邊事實上包括機組那乾式儲存你今天也提到了嘛對不對乾式儲存包括你們現在的已經開始招標的這乾式儲存廠的標也是要求這樣的一個標準對不對這台電公司的招標案不過台電公司招標案裡面對於耐震設計有特別的要求"},{"start":285.123,"end":300.714,"text":"對 而且是全部嘛 對不對包括是極端風險都已經包括進去了好 那另外的是在國軍戰略跟民防單位是否跟這樣的一個演習有沒有做計畫 因為現在想要全民任性包括如果遇到這種極端的情況是不是也沒有問題"},{"start":302.808,"end":330.507,"text":"就是保障核電廠是安全的啦是 包括委員相關的這些重大威脅都有納入它的演習的情境然後有做討論跟實際的一個演練所以剛才所說的有些委員他們所提到的這樣的安全包括不只是地震甚至連極端的危險的狀況的風險都已經包括進去都可以抵擋住對不對是是的這就表示說你核安會的這樣子的一個尬詞我覺得非常好讓全民在核在"},{"start":331.688,"end":355.276,"text":"國家的民意最高殿堂裡面立法院展現出這樣子一個核安的態度好那我們現在再看看是核三廠的議題我們現在已經進入到一個除疫的階段核三廠的一號機二號機電線現在所謂的過度的管制期包括說爐心的燃料也拿出來了那現在已經進入到的是所謂的自主安全檢查的一個時期對不對"},{"start":356.216,"end":371.348,"text":"那這個時期當中呢現在我就會遇到一個很大的問題就是說我也看到目前呢可以看到的是一個情況是因為經濟部部長他也提到的是台電預計在明年的"},{"start":372.949,"end":396.921,"text":"2026的3月要提出要提出來的是申請重啟的這個辦法 提出的計畫嘛 對不對那現在就必須要說剛剛尤其是河山廠的2號機材才進入到一個除役的階段那除役的階段面臨到的是25年可是我們也知道如果他明年3月就進行的一個重啟的計畫書要提出來申請的話那會遇到"},{"start":399.062,"end":420.954,"text":"廚藝跟重啟的這個有這樣子的一個重疊時間那請問一下在這個情況之下哪一個轉是不是會遇到有一個轉折點的情況那這個轉折點是在哪裡可能會在哪裡就現在已經有了資料上級長官經濟就是說另外的在屬於核三廠的我說核電廠的重啟這部分請回答"},{"start":424.6,"end":447.319,"text":"跟委員說明除役許可的申請案是執照到期前三年台電公司依法來向會裡面申請這部分就是等台電公司提出除役的環評報告之後如果符合法規 何安會才會合法除役許可目前如果按照台電公司或者經濟部對外說明如果明年三月提出換照的申請案"},{"start":447.859,"end":463.729,"text":"那核安委也是依法來就是還審理之後再看情況然後因為剛才委員提到除役跟重啟這兩件事情可能會並行那我們也會參考國外核電廠重啟的經驗就是恢復申請的經驗"},{"start":464.75,"end":481.933,"text":"那我们会针对重启的现场工作进行现场查证或视察那也会针对重启跟厨艺的共同事项来进行查证那这部分还是会持续办理一些干除设施用过燃料的一些安全的管制作业"},{"start":482.453,"end":506.621,"text":"換言之如果台電提出重啟的一個申請那當然依照程序去申請的話也提出你在審核包括的情況下就變成重啟會是比較優先的項目但是重啟跟在裡面他要預報過的是在核燃料裡面的這個燃料棒也是要拿起來如果他是說已經有空間乾除設施可以進去包括乾除廠也是會繼續再建嘛對不對"},{"start":507.561,"end":534.201,"text":"是的那現在的問題是那二號機的部分燃料池這部分也都大概有了解所以包括現在的處理設備的拆除這件事情基本上就會停止了廚藝當中的這個設備的拆除這部分會停止嗎跟委員說明現在是就是按照廚藝計畫的規劃是現在是過渡階段那台電公司就準備一些乾除設施的一些準備新建作業"},{"start":534.981,"end":557.833,"text":"因為現在還沒有正式提出來我一次用過燃料的安全好那現在可是已經看得到一號機我們已經看到說它的已經開工把設備拆除氮氣槽跟室水加清系統的部分那二號機是否還會繼續進行二號機的這個氮氣槽跟室水加清設備各位委員那是合一廠氮氣槽跟室水加清這是合一廠的"},{"start":558.584,"end":577.739,"text":"喔好那這樣子了解所以事實上核彈是更新型的嘛對不對就沒有這個設施好那我們現在要更強調的是另外一部分可是如果遇到的是核燃重啟喔那重啟的情況之下有一個問題是說核燃料的補充是重要的啦因為核燃料的補充我們現在看到這裡喔就是說"},{"start":578.78,"end":600.775,"text":"核燃料如果在營運的運轉的計畫裡面的核燃料補充這部分那到時候是會有誰來負責是來編預算等等的這部分有沒有考慮到這些事情因為你們可能也遇到這樣的情形要思考跟委員說明這個燃料者採購是屬於台電公司的商務採購合約那這部分細節要由台電公司去規劃說明"},{"start":601.872,"end":625.87,"text":"OK好那就是可能兩邊都被重啟了之後他表示核燃料的部分可能台電部分就會更重要的去下去負責這邊的一個重啟等等更重要的一個構置對不對好那可是剛才有一個問題是在於說另外剛才對重啟有個政策有說環評剛才說只要環評可是目前環境部的部長他要提到是說"},{"start":627.051,"end":649.585,"text":"要做環評 可是現在在目前的核子設施反應器的管制法當中並沒有關於特別所謂的他後來講到說政策環評因為考慮到要政策環評就會把人民的意見放進來當地的或是全國的意見中進來那請問一下對於政策環評我是注意到是政策環評的意見核安會的態度是怎麼樣"},{"start":651.992,"end":661.917,"text":"覺得有必要嗎如果有提出政策環評的話 那當然要修法可能在核子設施反應器的管制法裡面你們的態度是怎麼樣"},{"start":663.2,"end":689.063,"text":"核安會是負責核能安全管制對於輻射對環境的影響評估這責任完全是在核安會核安會要負起全部的責任核安會是負責環境評估對不對但是我現在說是政策環評因為現在環評裡面沒有特別去講到是對跟人的這方面的事情我們會跟其他議題我們會跟環境部協商討論"},{"start":690.063,"end":716.562,"text":"好那如果這樣的話是不是要涉及到要把核子設施反應器的管理管制法要做修訂才能加入到這個有法源依據是不是要有這樣的考量跟委員先補充說明那核安會是核安嘛主管機關那針對輻射的相關議題在我們的執法已經納進來了那這部分也是環稟的一部分那但是針對非輻射"},{"start":717.723,"end":746.522,"text":"非輻射相關的環境評估這部分那可能就要剛才主委有說明就是要跟環境部再去討論不過因為所有的事情因為剛才說辦法有可是所有的事情都需要要有法源依據的那目前政策環境是看到沒有的像跟環境部在做溝通之後這部分可能會是重要的一個依據不然沒有辦法的法源依據其實做不來只是在辦法上面它的一個執行的效力也是會有問題的我就提供到這樣子的一個意見我們希望在跟環境部的時候要注意到這個議題"},{"start":747.763,"end":756.53,"text":"好 谢谢主委请回谢谢刘淑冰委员的质询下一个请郭玉琴委员"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:53:51.229000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:53:51.589000+08:00","text":"有請陳主委。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-12-11T10:54:01.253000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:54:01.734000+08:00","text":"有請主委。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳主任委員明真","start":"2025-12-11T10:54:01.734000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2025-12-11T10:54:19.854000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:54:19.854000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:54:21.815000+08:00","text":"主委好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:54:22.716000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:54:50.922000+08:00","text":"我們在12月初的時候看到一則新聞，就是車諾比核電廠的防護牆遭重創，烏克蘭755億的核災設施出現破口，國際原子能總署警告，輻射外洩恐失控。","quality":0.845},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:54:52.062000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:04.486000+08:00","text":"這邊提到防護牆，針對此議題，最重要的是，核安會掌管核電廠的安全，請問我們的核電廠有沒有這樣子的防護牆？","quality":0.891},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:05.287000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:17.313000+08:00","text":"還有，我國核電廠的安全設計有沒有對應國際原子能總署所提到的「戰時核安指引」與「外部威脅評估」的要求？","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"陳主任委員明真","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:17.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:17.793000+08:00","text":"這點請組長說明。","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"林組長貞絢","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:22.116000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:40.423000+08:00","text":"報告委員，委員所問的是針對IAEA最新的戰時指引跟外部威脅這些重大評估，目前台電公司都已經訂了核電廠面臨軍事威脅下確保核安的準備跟應變計畫以及相關的程序書，也透過每年的演習檢討、精進。","quality":0.977},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:41.663000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:45.485000+08:00","text":"所以台電有這樣的一個計畫書嘛，對不對？是。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:45.485000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:46.685000+08:00","text":"也有在演習嘛，對不對？是。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:47.366000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:51.748000+08:00","text":"這個部分是不是可以給本席，或是台電已經放到他們官網上面了嗎？","quality":0.821},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:53.754000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:55:55.334000+08:00","text":"有知道這件事情嗎？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林組長貞絢","start":"2025-12-11T10:55:55.334000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:05.317000+08:00","text":"報告委員，因為有些內容涉及保安的部分，是屬於比較機敏的，但是在演練的時候，我們都會派員去視察、檢視。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:56:05.317000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:08.398000+08:00","text":"好，你們核安會知道嘛，對不對？是。","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:56:12.319000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:15.160000+08:00","text":"如果可以的話，我希望給本席一份說明，有沒有機會？","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:56:17.616000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:19.797000+08:00","text":"還有核子安全的設施等等。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:56:20.338000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:39.229000+08:00","text":"好，沒關係，我想問的是，計畫書裡面有沒有包含無人機的攻擊、飛彈落彈還有長時間斷電等「設計基準外事件」這些內容？","quality":0.896},{"speaker":"林組長貞絢","start":"2025-12-11T10:56:40.561000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:41.182000+08:00","text":"報告委員，有的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林組長貞絢","start":"2025-12-11T10:56:41.362000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:48.626000+08:00","text":"像委員所提的無人機攻擊是近年非常重視的一個議題，每年也都有進行演練。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:56:49.747000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:56:59.493000+08:00","text":"這樣子表示我們針對國際原子能總署最重要、最新的趨勢，已經有因應像烏俄戰爭中的無人機攻擊。","quality":0.805},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:57:02.374000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:57:20.845000+08:00","text":"接下來，我們在8月20號考察核三廠的時候，台電許永輝副總回應現場質疑，說核三廠的完整安全性，不只原始設計的抗震是0.4g，還加上所有極端風險的機率性考量。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:57:21.505000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:57:35.139000+08:00","text":"因此，台電許副總認為核安會所說的加固到1.384g是考量到所有安全性風險機率的抗震能力，並非只是抵抗單純地震。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:57:35.539000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:57:37.481000+08:00","text":"這非常重要，因為核安會是做把關的。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:57:38.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:57:50.073000+08:00","text":"請問主委或者是高斌組長，除役中機組，核三、核二的乾式貯存設施是否已經納入戰時防護情境？","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:57:50.553000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:57:57.437000+08:00","text":"是否與國軍戰略、民防單位有計畫銜接，保障核電在極端風險下仍然是安全的？","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"陳組長文泉","start":"2025-12-11T10:57:59.678000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:58:13.914000+08:00","text":"報告委員，因為我們臺灣的乾式貯存設施系統，其實都引進於美國NRC核准的系統，開發商當時在設計的時候，有些乾貯甚至採用飛機撞擊去做測試。","quality":0.903},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:58:17.932000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:58:29.799000+08:00","text":"所以包括機組還有你們已經開始招標的乾式貯存場，也有要求這樣的標準，對不對？","quality":0.853},{"speaker":"陳組長文泉","start":"2025-12-11T10:58:29.799000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:58:35.543000+08:00","text":"這是台電公司的招標案，不過台電公司招標案裡面對於耐震設計有特別的要求。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:58:36.123000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:58:39.265000+08:00","text":"對，而且是全部，包括極端風險都已經包括進去了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:58:40.086000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:58:47.010000+08:00","text":"另外，在國軍戰略跟民防單位演習，有沒有做計畫銜接？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:58:47.010000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:58:51.714000+08:00","text":"因為現在都說全民韌性，包括如果遇到極端的情況，是不是也沒有問題？","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:58:53.808000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:58:55.369000+08:00","text":"就是保障核電廠是安全的啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"林組長貞絢","start":"2025-12-11T10:58:56.350000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:59:03.735000+08:00","text":"報告委員，相關這些重大威脅都有納入演習的情境，有做討論跟實際的演練。","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:59:03.735000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:59:16.384000+08:00","text":"所以剛才所說的，有些委員所提到的安全，包括不只是地震，甚至連極端危險狀況的風險都已經包括進去了，都可以抵擋住，對不對？是。是的！","quality":0.982},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:59:17.024000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:59:19.766000+08:00","text":"這就展現出核安會的guts，我覺得非常好！","quality":0.632},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:59:21.487000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T10:59:26.749000+08:00","text":"在國家最高民意殿堂立法院展現出核安會的態度。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T10:59:28.370000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:00:11.472000+08:00","text":"接下來是有關核三廠的議題，1號機已經進入除役階段，2號機目前在過渡管制階段，包括爐心的燃料也拿出來了，已經進入自主安全檢查時期，這個時期當中，就會遇到一個很大的問題，目前我們可以看到的情況是，因為經濟部部長也提到台電預計在明（2026）年3月要提出申請重啟的計畫，對不對？","quality":0.863},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:00:13.153000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:00:40.448000+08:00","text":"尤其是核三廠的二號機才進入除役階段，可是除役階段面臨到的是25年，可是我們也知道，如果明年3月台電要將重啟計畫書提出來申請的話，會遇到除役跟重啟間重疊的時間，請問一下，在這個情況之下，是不是會遇到有一個轉折點的情況？","quality":0.866},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:00:40.888000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:00:42.869000+08:00","text":"就現在已經有的資料來看，這個轉折點可能會在哪裡？","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:00:44.790000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:00:51.934000+08:00","text":"包括你的上級長官經濟部，另外對核電廠重啟這部分的看法，請回答。","quality":0.679},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:00:55.600000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:01:11.613000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，除役許可申請案是執照到期前三年，台電公司依法來向會裡面申請，這部分就等台電公司提出除役的環評報告之後，如果符合法規，核安會才會核發除役許可。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:01:11.793000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:01:20+08:00","text":"目前按照台電公司或者經濟部對外的說明，如果明年3月提出換照的申請案，核安會也是依法審查。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:01:20.960000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:01:23.382000+08:00","text":"就是在審理之後，再看情況，如果……","quality":0.769},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:01:23.822000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:01:28.205000+08:00","text":"因為剛才委員提到除役跟重啟這兩件事情可能會並行嘛。對！","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:01:29.066000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:01:52.712000+08:00","text":"我們也會參考國外核電廠重啟的經驗，即恢復申請的經驗，我們會針對重啟的事件、重啟的現場工作進行現場查證或視察，也會針對重啟跟除役的共通事項來進行查證，這部分還是會持續辦理一些乾貯設施、用過燃料的安全管制作業。","quality":0.594},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:01:53.453000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:02:18.701000+08:00","text":"換言之，如果台電提出重啟的申請，當然依照程序去申請的話，也是你們在審核，就變成重啟會是比較優先的項目，但是重啟，包括核燃料裡面的燃料棒也要拿起來，如果它有空間，乾貯設施就會開始進去，包括乾貯場也會繼續再興建，對不對？是的！","quality":0.859},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:02:19.682000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:02:35.554000+08:00","text":"但現在的問題是二號機的燃料池，這部分也大概有了解，包括現在的處理、設備的拆除，基本上就會停止了，除役當中的設備拆除這部分會停止嗎？","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:02:35.554000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:02:45.201000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，按照除役計畫的規劃，現在是過渡階段，台電公司就準備一些乾貯設施的興建作業，目前是沒有……","quality":0.773},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:02:45.981000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:02:47.582000+08:00","text":"因為現在還沒有正式提出來。","quality":1},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:02:48.002000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:02:48.783000+08:00","text":"維持用過燃料的安全。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:02:49.423000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:03:04.210000+08:00","text":"好，可是我們看到一號機已經開工把設備拆除，即氮氣槽跟飼水加氫系統的部分，二號機是否還會繼續進行拆除氮氣槽跟飼水加氫設施？","quality":0.821},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:03:04.731000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:03:08.813000+08:00","text":"那是核一廠，氮氣槽跟飼水加氫是核一廠的乾貯除役作業。","quality":0.583},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:03:09.944000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:03:13.968000+08:00","text":"好，了解，事實上核三廠是更新型的，對不對？","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:03:13.968000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:03:14.708000+08:00","text":"就沒有這個設施。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:03:15.609000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:03:39.007000+08:00","text":"我們現在要更強調的是另外一部分，如果遇到的是重啟的情況之下，有一個問題是，核燃料的補充是重要的，在運轉的計畫裡面，核燃料補充這部分到時候會由誰來負責、來編預算等等，有沒有考慮到這些事情？","quality":0.988},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:03:39.727000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:03:41.849000+08:00","text":"你們可能也會遇到這樣的情形，要去思考。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:03:43.109000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:03:51.755000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，燃料的採購是屬於台電公司的商務採購合約，細節要由台電公司去規劃說明。","quality":0.919},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:03:52.872000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:04:04.101000+08:00","text":"OK，可能重啟之後，在核燃料的部分，可能由台電去負責這邊的重啟等等，更重要的是購置，對不對？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:04:04.101000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:04:33.981000+08:00","text":"好，還有一個問題是在於重啟有個政策、有環評，剛才都提到環評，先前環境部部長提到要做環評，可是在目前的核子反應器設施管制法當中，並沒有關於他所強調的政策環評，因為考慮到要政策環評，就會把人民的意見放進來，當地或是全國的意見都要放進來。","quality":0.877},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:04:34.201000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:04:40.585000+08:00","text":"請問一下，對於政策環評，我是注意到政策環評的意見，核安會的態度是怎麼樣？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:04:42.992000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:04:43.592000+08:00","text":"覺得有必要嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:04:43.592000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:04:52.917000+08:00","text":"如果有提出政策環評的話，當然要修法，可能在核子反應器設施管制法裡面，你們的態度是怎麼樣？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"陳主任委員明真","start":"2025-12-11T11:04:54.200000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:05:07.352000+08:00","text":"核安會是負責核能安全管制，對於輻射對環境的影響評估，這責任完全是在核安會，核安會要負起全部的責任。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:05:07.572000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:05:09.234000+08:00","text":"核安會是負責環境評估，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:05:09.234000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:05:15.039000+08:00","text":"但我現在是說政策環評，因為現在環評裡面沒有特別去講到跟人的……","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"陳主任委員明真","start":"2025-12-11T11:05:15.159000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:05:20.063000+08:00","text":"這方面的事情，其他的議題我們會跟環境部協商討論。","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:05:21.063000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:05:32.171000+08:00","text":"好，這件事如果是這樣的話，是不是要涉及到把核子反應器設施管制法要做修訂，才能有法源依據，是不是要有這樣的考量？","quality":0.88},{"speaker":"高組長斌","start":"2025-12-11T11:05:32.551000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:05:57.689000+08:00","text":"跟委員補充說明，核安會是核安的主管機關，針對輻射的相關議題，在我們的子法已經納進來了，這部分也是環評的一部分，但是針對非輻射相關的環境評估部分，剛才主委有說明，就是要跟環境部再去討論。","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2025-12-11T11:05:58.750000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:06:17.522000+08:00","text":"因為剛才說辦法有，可是所有的事情都需要有法源依據，目前政策環評是沒有的，你們跟環境部溝通之後，這部分可能會是重要的一個依據，不然沒有法源依據，其實做不來，只有辦法的話，它的執行效力也是會有問題的，我就提供這樣的意見，我們希望你們跟環境部討論時要注意到這個議題，謝謝。","quality":0.901},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-12-11T11:06:20.404000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:06:24.668000+08:00","text":"主委請回，也謝謝劉書彬委員的質詢。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2025-12-11T11:06:26.349000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2025-12-11T11:06:27.389000+08:00","text":"下一位請郭昱晴委員。","quality":0.444}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}