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院長你所說是這一次而已喔未來的情況之下我們現在等一下繼續再問下去就是說如果會發生到說這個部分影響到四月你說也四月可能沒有問題可是影響到五月的部分尤其是現在還不只是因為塔達的因素如果是中國"},{"start":212.391,"end":227.972,"text":"來做封鎖的情況之下你不知道什麼時間會萬一他真的封鎖起來超過12天的話怎麼辦所以趕快把我們的能量創大起來啊如果我們有更強的國防體系的話那我們可以更及早建造更安全的國家"},{"start":229.039,"end":246.195,"text":"那現在就是希望 我們已經看到啦 看到有這種狀況 所以我們趕快今天不開始 明天就會來不及今天趕快開始 就永遠可以有進步到我們必須安全保障自己的那一邊人員任性啊 沒有一個國家 人員任性應該是多元的 現在只是有在生人員跟"},{"start":248.337,"end":273.856,"text":"剛剛跟您說的三月、四月都沒有問題,就是任性結果之外我們現在說的還包括是被封鎖,台海被封鎖,這是最重要的問題看起來是沒有回答,還在用塔達的問題來處理那更重要的問題是因為台灣的問題,包括是美國的智庫CSIS在去年在八月份的時候,它的最新的兵推報告都顯示出來了模擬共軍對台海實施封鎖的時候,顯示台灣在時間會耗盡"},{"start":275.717,"end":297.433,"text":"天然氣的儲量 那煤跟石油分別是在七週跟二十週要耗盡台灣總發電量只剩下封鎖前的百分之二十屆時所有的製造業都會停擺那才問得到說因為美國的海軍情報呢也指揮官他也說這個Mike Stanton他也提到說在聽證會上他說至少台灣要有一"},{"start":298.294,"end":324.948,"text":"一座的核能電廠才能夠減輕能源被供應切斷的這樣的一個危機那這樣的情況我們是不是考慮到台灣有沒有考慮到說把核能的針對暫時封鎖的情境把核能作為一個穩定發展的一個來源有這個考慮到嗎部長說嗎因為現在核能的部分我們核三廠已經開始啟動這個自主安全檢查那三月份就會送出再運轉計畫"},{"start":326.26,"end":334.145,"text":"那就是盡快的 因為在法律的授權之下盡快是 像我下面看到的這個情況是盡快的是 看他看他是不是在2028年因為我們跟這個西屋公司已經簽約了嘛盡快的 要看他這個機組的老化情況要汰換的這些設備是多還少如果這個汰換的設備都很好不用汰換太多 那時間就可以縮短"},{"start":355.418,"end":380.487,"text":"所以有機會會在平均大概兩年的時間之前會把它結束這樣有機會看實際狀況我們會盡快另外一個重要的問題是在於非碳電力的問題因為我們的經濟部、能源局這邊、能源署這邊它還一直堅守的是一個RE100用再生能源的百分之百再生能源來講可是現在國際的科技企業界"},{"start":381.207,"end":400.578,"text":"他們所採用的是24小時7天的無碳電力法規上沒有R100但是R100是廠商他自主的承諾現在是我現在跟國際間已經出現到這邊因為我們等一下就講到是目前我們再生能源的部分現在到2025年只有378億度的電"},{"start":405.26,"end":426.969,"text":"378億度的電但是呢未來的需求呢如果說現在的依照每年還需要2.5%的能源成長的話預計到2030年是將近到要有大概900億度的電900億度的電900億度的電是再生能源喔但是如果說全部是3000億度的電3000億度的電是不是30%要再生能源 是吧"},{"start":427.808,"end":442.939,"text":"我們現在還是照我們的預估的啦就是20%的目標往前進就可以完成那我是算出來因為我們這幾天一直在問能源署的官員們結果幾天都沒有下來這個因為都是用的是"},{"start":443.76,"end":468.027,"text":"所謂的往再生能源的佔比去加那我們就在推因為我們這2.5%的一個成長率到2030年預計就會有3000億度的電要出現那30%裡面就是900億度可是現在2025年的時候就只有378億度電我們預計因為現在的再生能源只有已經跳票了預計說今年要20%事實上只有13到16點多%都自己都跳票了"},{"start":470.948,"end":478.97,"text":"沒有,現在事實上看到的就是最多到16%而已對,15點多那你現在已經跳票20%你預計還要2030年,現在只剩下4年時間4年時間你要成長從378億度墊變成900億度墊我預計大概成長一倍的話大概就是700億度可能有200億度的缺的部分"},{"start":497.256,"end":501,"text":"那你如果還是沒有辦法用RE100的情況你現在缺了200億度要從哪裡來"},{"start":503.735,"end":527.287,"text":"八五元不是所有的企業他都承諾R100啦有一些公司他有承諾現在大概三十幾家在台灣來講我們現在不只台灣喔我們輝達也要進來對不對還有美光也要進來對不對這些都是國際大廠200億度電而且你事實上就跳票了嘛300%的再生能源的電力就是沒有達到嘛就是這樣子所以"},{"start":528.477,"end":543.564,"text":"特別要請政府好好去考慮到需要用到非碳的電力不然的話你2030年已經票票的部分已經回報達成了這個推動工作還是持續進行而且就像委員講我們要努力"},{"start":544.764,"end":561.294,"text":"這部分我會影響到我國吸引外資跟維持出口競爭力這地方請卓政府一定要好好去了解到這個地方但是現在外資對台灣的投資環境非常滿意昨天ENGINE來拜訪我他說百分之九十幾的廠商會持續投資台灣"},{"start":562.588,"end":586.542,"text":"但是現在的中資包括像輝達、電力中心包括我們是AI的部分曾文森的董事長他還說的全球競爭利益的部分就是需要有非幹電力從現在看起來經濟部跟左任府您事實上忽略到我們台灣對於全球的淨零碳排的一個目標的需求我沒有忽略啊 剛剛部長都講得很清楚"},{"start":587.622,"end":607.174,"text":"2050年我們還是世界大廠是必須要一步一步的你2030年沒有達到競爭可以跳到這是太誇張了一步一步一年一年的往上追趕目標不過我們在想您有提到如果是在非碳建立當中你說剛才也有講到預計核三廠是現在已經提出來的一個自主安全報告送到核安衛隊去對不對"},{"start":611.737,"end":637.573,"text":"那預計剛才有提到的是可能預計是2028現在可能會提早嘛提早會可能如果安全設施都無疑是一件設備都安全的話可能就會提早這營運嘛那現在的還有一個問題是因為卓院長你一直在提到的是如果還核能的部分再一個可能就是新式的核能機組對不對或是所謂的核融合的技術那現在有一個問題是在於核融合的技術啊"},{"start":638.803,"end":655.348,"text":"您剛才應該也問了別的人,那是為了變成委員我們都知道,核融化的技術哪現在還在開發的階段,研發階段那到2030年才具備最快最快到2030年中才具備商轉的可能性嘛那這個部分我剛才只強調的所有的數據到2030年的時候就已經可能會跳票"},{"start":658.829,"end":673.926,"text":"就已經可能就跳票了那現在的情況那你現在的核電廠的部分核三廠的他現在跟他說缺200億度電如果核三廠的168億度電用的話其實可以在兩年之後也可以補上這個缺口就是一個很大的幫助點那可是剛才說的"},{"start":674.967,"end":695.045,"text":"SMR這部分看起來政府對於SMR的這個考量並沒有想做這次好像畫一個大餅在未來因為2030年等於說你到2030年中才會出現那你2030年到2030年中間之後的這部分呢可能有5年之間是沒有辦法有再生能源的這個部分的這個這樣子的一個把"},{"start":695.625,"end":715.23,"text":"我們還是繼續推動二次能源轉型除了多元發展綠能之外我們的深度的節能 科技的儲能這個都會全面展開另外電廣的韌性也會加強這個都是在強化整個供電的系統所以是多元的離岸風電還是持續的在推動這個部分我剛剛其實都有算過因為你們30%那重點是"},{"start":718.411,"end":745.224,"text":"昨天講你說的這些部分都是該做的,可是一個國家最重要的部分就是在多元的、能源的開源,這是多元的所以確實請你要注意到這部分,不然的話你畫的S6法這部分也是沒有做,除了這些都節能都應該做,這邊我們再繼續往下看還有想要談一個議題,再就是脫掉這樣跟你分享一個新聞就是看到了初六機車它拖了兩公里,竟然所價是五萬一千元"},{"start":746.364,"end":763.693,"text":"這個部分到底是行情還是在搶劫問題可能是在制度很失靈我們看到是交通部我們上週原本黨團也有開了一個協調會裡面談到說交通部它只管國道跟快速道路的拖吊業因為把它當作特許的行業但是由高工局來去管理"},{"start":764.193,"end":779.798,"text":"但是一般的道路呢市區道路拖吊業卻要交由地方政府去進行拖吊業並沒有納入到公路法的管理當中導致大量的拖吊的詐欺事件都是以消費正義來處理而且還曠日廢食民怨四起"},{"start":781.699,"end":804.593,"text":"數據顯示說 這兩三年來 陳貝的申訴案件就出現了警察還說 他民事糾紛 他不敢介入 中央要退地方地方要給消保官 行政制度那我想要問的是 院長這邊 由於我們看到檢視的問題很大在於說 公路法這裡啊公路法當中的 並沒有把拖吊業者納管"},{"start":805.458,"end":822.933,"text":"好那如果沒有納管的話他根本就沒有辦法去做管理甚至我們當初問交通部的一個專員他是說到底現在在一般的道路上面到底有多少的業者大小的他都說不清楚因為沒有辦法管我們重點現在想問的是說公路法修法有沒有把要把脫掉業者要納入到公路法當中修法"},{"start":824.54,"end":851.765,"text":"是 跟委員先報告 等一下請部長說明因為我們也跟委員一樣非常重視一些年節的時候這種拖吊 交通的拖吊會發生一個亂象雖然中央地方各有管轄的不同的路域但是我們希望能夠有一個比較強大的一個管理的規則一定要把這些業者納進來管理因為他現在他沒有辦法納進來管理他不是公路法上面所稱的所謂運輸業所以他沒有納出來那我們要想辦法把他納進來管理"},{"start":852.905,"end":870.251,"text":"對 可是公路法當中在車子為什麼把它當作運輸業這就是應該是修法作為立法委員我們就在反映這樣的民意因為公路法並不是管的是運輸嘛公路法關的是所有上面的在車子在道路上面行駛都可能尤其尤其你車子部分沒有這種的一個"},{"start":871.651,"end":877.198,"text":"現在其實不是沒有法可以管我們現在消費者保護的這個法令都可以管得到只是說執行上要怎麼執行但委員我知道您的質疑"},{"start":889.933,"end":918.121,"text":"所以我們現在正在努力就是說我們現在您剛剛有提到我們在公路就是省道或者是高速公路我們其實管理得不錯那我們會以那個經驗來制定一個協助制定一個所謂的定型化契約透過這樣子的定型化契約來協助各個地方都有這樣定型化契約出來之後如果有遇到消費上面的糾紛我們就可以依照這個定型化契約來處理我們希望在今年年底之前可以完成這樣子的努力"},{"start":919.081,"end":934.048,"text":"請部長說明目前這個偵辦的狀況那個跟委員報告齁那個春節期間有拖掉蟑螂這個橫行的這部分齁台北地檢署跟新北地檢署都有份案在偵辦中好這部分因為謝謝鄭部長但是我重點是"},{"start":935.745,"end":960.953,"text":"卓院長陳部長您的問題沒有看到重點您受限於沒錯你如果變成就是消費者的部分像觀光業啊甚至補銷業啊把它當做定型化契約去管理那個是我們在規定是你這自編本身是自結啊所以本的問題是它本身就應該放在交通的公路法當中或是相關的要法有法源基礎啊去進行"},{"start":961.733,"end":977.023,"text":"如果沒有這部分去處理甚至這個部分還涉及到的是你對於一般的公路的上面的拖吊業者他甚至剛才說的引起到的是刑事的犯罪有詐欺等等的這個出現重點是我要知道是這個部分是非常重要的"},{"start":977.563,"end":995.631,"text":"竟然沒有法源基礎你現在被他用消保法這不是知情啦一般的市區道路裡面本來他的管理規則就不太一樣例如說我舉個例客運公車他是運輸業當然我們的公路法也好或者是交通部當然也會納管但在地方上的管理還是由地方政府來執行"},{"start":996.491,"end":1009.61,"text":"這就是問題啊因為22縣市通通都有這個問題的時候為什麼中央沒有辦法統一的一個我們現在就是要來協助地方來做定型化契約我們希望每一個地方都有自己的定型化契約能夠做得出來"},{"start":1010.609,"end":1013.152,"text":"縣市所管的道路上面發生的問題"},{"start":1028.749,"end":1056.912,"text":"有部分它就是屬於地方自治事項對 但是管理制度上面每個地方都有問題的時候我們會想辦法設一個法令讓大家能夠共同遵守但是地方也可以自己有一個自治的法規那這個都是要呈現來做的那我們看到這個亂象剛剛部長也說過了正在準備要做這個強力納管的時候你怎麼會說他都沒準備呢我們現在在召集各個縣市大家一起來共領一個方案但我們先優先的是"},{"start":1058.613,"end":1070.018,"text":"從高速公路跟省道他們管理的經驗他們的定型化契約先訂出來作為一個範本讓所有的地方可以來作為一個參考"},{"start":1070.994,"end":1088.508,"text":"我們希望未來在修法制的時候朝野雙方能夠多一點溝通看怎麼樣朝一個最能夠治本的方式去助理我們繼續往下看另外一個問題是測速照相機測速照相機本來是應該要去降低的事故"},{"start":1089.008,"end":1114.455,"text":"可是事實上看到的是台灣的測速照相機的密度是日本的300多倍然後罰單數量是日本的3倍但是交通死亡率卻是日本的5倍全台有超過2500隻的測速桿可是我們看到如果說測速高速是發生死亡車禍裡面最大的原因可是我們看到的是最重要的是因為駕駛人的疏忽等等的"},{"start":1115.115,"end":1136.56,"text":"並沒有對症下藥,因為看到的從台北市的數據來看看等等包括是在車道變化不當,還有就是駕駛的疏忽等等的請問這個院長或部長看到說超速並非是交通事故的主因的時候目前廣設這樣子的一個測速照相桿是什麼樣的一個意義啊?到底是在拼營收嗎?還是在救命啊?"},{"start":1136.98,"end":1163.163,"text":"跟委員報告您的這個數據跟我們這邊所掌握真正有去延期之後的數據是不太一樣的因為在車禍發生的第一時間當然我們就是這樣登錄沒有任何一個駕駛會承認自己是超速所以在裡面大部分都不會說大部分的人都會說我是恍神我是不小心所以第一時間的登錄是這樣但如果真正做整個車禍的測量或者是延期之後我們有發現"},{"start":1164.824,"end":1184.661,"text":"車禍因為車速過快造成的車禍高達四成到五成左右各國的數據其實都差不多那也跟委員報告一件事就是說您說台灣有兩千多隻的車速照相但我們的這個死亡率卻沒有像日本這麼低我要跟委員報告其實車禍的事故有很多的樣態"},{"start":1185.962,"end":1214.385,"text":"那測速照相跟車禍不一定有必然關係坦白這樣講那日本他們有沒有比較守法有沒有超速的比較少應該是有那也跟委員報告台灣的密度其實也沒有特別高您剛剛所提到的台灣有兩千多隻的測速照相機但是我要跟委員報告的是光是韓國韓國在這幾年的交通改革非常成功所以他們的死亡率降肥非常快但我也要跟委員報告的是他光是首爾市測速照相機超過兩千隻"},{"start":1215.822,"end":1244.275,"text":"超過兩千隻也就是說大家依照速度管理下去很合法合規的駕駛這是很正常的也應該要做的這個對交通管理絕對是有幫助的如果是這樣子的話那請跟廣為跟民眾要說清楚那這部分的報告是不是也給本席要有一份這個沒有問題好 那另外我們想要看的是可是我們想說這個尤其測速照相機的設置跟改善交通效益這個部分的效果你們有做報告嗎你們有做研究嗎"},{"start":1245.151,"end":1270.522,"text":"我跟委員報告大部分的測速照相機都是地方政府包含那個罰款我自己當過台中市議員我很清楚我在審預算的時候發現台中市政府一年可以編二十幾億的這個罰款收入這些收入都在地方政府不是中央要去設置的但我只是跟委員報告說速度管理對於整個交通管理來講降低死亡絕對是有幫助的"},{"start":1271.428,"end":1300.968,"text":"好 我們就希望說看到這邊的這個報告看到是不是從地方政府拿到的這樣的報告繼續往下看的是這個口袋的部分就是前年就有300億元的這個部分那現在的它的根據道交條例跟它的道路交通違規罰還收入分配跟運用辦法可以看到說這邊的錢基本上如果以直轄市來講的話百分之75個縣市然後其中12%才是改善的交通設施"},{"start":1301.668,"end":1319.537,"text":"那63%是被到一般地方政府去運用的那如果在交通部的內政部警政署這邊有17萬有國安交通的管理基金重點是想說這些人收到的錢能不能夠是把它用在所謂的改善道路交通而不變成是財政的地方的收入"},{"start":1321.338,"end":1347.237,"text":"這個部分我相當支持因為我們是用這個違規的收入違規為什麼要罰是因為希望交通更安全所以應該罰款的收入應該要來改善交通整體的交通的安全狀況才是正道目前我確實有看到一個現象就是說很多的地方政府把它變成是一個小金庫在使用並不是真正把它拿來道路改善或者是安全改善我是希望這個比例可以增加"},{"start":1347.737,"end":1362.018,"text":"那我也請我們部內開始在研析這個問題但這也涉及到整個財政收支的一些問題包含這個財政紀律的問題在之前有些法令上面的限制那我們希望能夠推這方面的改革那也希望我們可以繼續"},{"start":1363.44,"end":1377.93,"text":"年底的選舉又快到了我們年底之前能夠提出交通部的期待的方案跟法案但這也需要立法院這邊大家一起來幫忙因為那個之前所設定的法令限制其實蠻多的我們要一起來解套"},{"start":1378.43,"end":1396.139,"text":"好 那另外的 謝謝陳部長那現在要請的是一個關於義男的體位區分標準的修正的部分草案的說明我們看到這次在國防部跟內政部他們所提出來的合期但是以國防部為主的有180種的這次的體位區分標準的修正是有180種的身心的疾患然後他把免疫變成了一個徵章標準比南韓還要嚴"},{"start":1405.123,"end":1431.008,"text":"那這個問題就想要問的是第一個他在做這個行政的涵釋的時候呢一般呢要說公告有相關法令的需要用到60天這是只有到45天而且聽到的是沒有開公聽會那這部分哪一個院長你是不是請看誰要去報告說為什麼這部分都違反到原來的這樣子的公告公告要做溝通跟說明跟公聽會去取到政黨的意見這個問題"},{"start":1435.489,"end":1455.16,"text":"有關於體位區分標準的修正其實我們在一月底的時候剛剛預告結束我們在體位區分標準的過程當中除了內政部國防部還有跟衛福部一起來商量跟討論那預告結束之後確實有些團體有不同的意見所以我們會把這個意見全部收整之後才做公告"},{"start":1455.64,"end":1483.207,"text":"那為什麼要做體位區分標準的部分是這樣子就是說有關於這個替代疫的部分我們如果跟其他國家相比我們的免疫標準是16%那這包括南韓或其他的只有3%到6%而已所以我們覺得說有些人是為了逃避這個兵疫所以我們以修正這個體位區分標準來處理那同時也因應我們現在的兵疫制度是從四個月延長到一年的期間所以會有加嚴的這個標準出現"},{"start":1484.087,"end":1505.532,"text":"好但是現在很重要的是包括的是你們現在把一些尤其是有些心理的狀況的部分我特別要講到是說包括A B的那個體位到底怎麼區分他們怎麼樣訓練因為都要進入到成功你做一個新兵的一個基礎的一個體位基礎的一個訓練我們可以看到是說特別是針對有時候跨性別者"},{"start":1506.252,"end":1533.112,"text":"他們目前的草案是說把免疫改為替代育的A級替代育採取的方式怎麼樣採取集體的住宿而且用男性化管理的模式而且剪了很極短的團法集體寢室跟公寓的安排這對於有些接受到荷爾蒙治療的跨性別女性而言確實會表達很驚恐的性別跟否定的身體暴露面對這個情形的話"},{"start":1534.503,"end":1557.529,"text":"這部分有更進步的就是有沒有把這意見再拿進來去修訂是謝謝委員的關心有關於性別心理的特殊狀況的部分我們衛福部跟相關的專業的精神醫學會有得到一定的程度的共識也就是說我們希望採取一年當中用持續追蹤的方式來了解它是否適合服替代役"},{"start":1558.169,"end":1581.001,"text":"那另外一個在我們替代役所訓練的這個中心以這個成功率為主的話我們在所謂的跨性別友善的住宿環境呢會來做改善那這個部分呢我們有持續跟公民團體的訪問可是如果要集體住宿這場情況這種制度可以報告委員我想您大概知道以目前服兵役來看連我們的這個常備兵對不起就是專業的這個服兵役也有女兵"},{"start":1581.861,"end":1607.592,"text":"所以事實上在性別友善的這個空間裡面怎麼做比較好的修正我覺得說按照兵役法因為服兵役是台灣國民的義務我們也應該朝著這方面來處理但是我們現在有給這個所謂的性別心理狀態比較特殊的這些人在申請的期間會用一年的時間採取這個每一個月或每兩個月到一個專業的精神醫師這邊做身心診斷的狀況來做追蹤辦理"},{"start":1610.293,"end":1636.575,"text":"看到是不是符合這個免疫的標準好這邊就你們會繼續再去追蹤就對了那另外的關於說不堪服病疫者本來以前是當作免疫啦現在把它當作是行動不便者也需要他人去照顧的呢線說是這樣那只要是一般四肢健全的啦但是他如果有心臟病啊器官移植等等的這些僵直性脊椎炎的他沒有身障證明好像還是繼續在裡面作息"},{"start":1636.875,"end":1653.105,"text":"就是可以變成到一個替代役會被徵招等等那我們過去看到一些替代役的部分有些追監牌突出的意難陳俊明還發生入伍後就救急復發還被認為說是裝病結果後來就失去了生命這個問題上面是不是能夠針對"},{"start":1655.044,"end":1671.325,"text":"陳功嶺當中的長期醫療資源一年的不足的部分要去做修訂報告委員我們這次的修訂範圍非常的廣193項修訂了180項次但是大家都知道扶替代役跟一般到國防部的單位去服役是不太一樣的"},{"start":1672.006,"end":1698.25,"text":"譬如說我們這個有嘉陰替代役也有產業替代役有社會替代役也就是說他在成功嶺服26天的這樣子的一個體能訓練部長我剛才就是問成功嶺的問題那個替代役的藝男陳俊明就是在入伍後就是好那如果說在成功嶺裡面有這樣子一個不健全或者是說有受到這個不安全的狀況之下呢請來告訴我們我們來做一下檢討跟修正"},{"start":1698.902,"end":1708.255,"text":"好最後一個問題就想到的是一個我們這次看到的是這兩位部長請回那關於在卓院長你在這次的"},{"start":1712.404,"end":1736.781,"text":"這個報告當中,施政報公有特別提到是說有一個兒少的發展專戶嘛這個帳戶呢,這樣從弱勢就是原來從107年所說的部分他就要把它的,有要擴大的意思但我們看到說你有這樣的,我們就用心但是兒少帳戶這個帳戶呢適用對象是有預計要從弱勢團,弱勢兒童要擴展到全部的兒少嗎?"},{"start":1737.842,"end":1756.492,"text":"或是新生兒嗎因為我們從國民年金老農津貼一直到最近討論的六大生活補助我們認為應該更完善的一個整個對青少年朋友們整套的從生育養育到教育整套的計畫所以過去的兒少專戶他面對的是低收中低收入戶"},{"start":1757.152,"end":1778.481,"text":"所以這個執行的成果是有限的那麼我們如果要擴大的話要普遍化的話那能不能在財政考量之下做一個更普遍性周圍性把對象擴大金額合理讓他能夠在人生的不同階段他就可以有自己可以自主性的一筆一開始的一個小小的財源"},{"start":1779.488,"end":1782.413,"text":"我們現在已經做到了就是補到10萬元未來我們隨著各種條件我們還可以增加我要說的是人生的第一桶金這部分跟我們"},{"start":1794.731,"end":1812.61,"text":"在野黨在一月份所提出來的台灣未來賬戶事實上是蠻有相近的意圖在但是要考慮到國家財政的能力所以我反正到時候都已經排進來審嘛對不對那我想說是不是大家有共識就往那邊幫我們下一代尤其是親生兒的出生率發展繼續再做努力OK好就這樣謝謝謝謝劉書斌委員的質詢"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:18:40.073000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:18:43.414000+08:00","text":"謝謝院長、謝謝主席，有請卓院長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-10T11:18:43.414000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:18:43.834000+08:00","text":"麻煩再請卓院長備詢。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:18:49.424000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:18:49.524000+08:00","text":"劉委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:18:49.544000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:18:49.604000+08:00","text":"院長辛苦了。不會。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:18:49.644000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:32.097000+08:00","text":"我看到今天早上已經有很多的委員問過您，關於3月7號在東京大巨蛋觀賞臺捷大戰的經過，在過程當中，其實很多民眾關心，因為您也說過這就是一個私人的行程，然後是華航包機在松指部停機坪起飛。","quality":0.915},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:32.677000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:33.337000+08:00","text":"至於花了多少錢？","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:33.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:34.737000+08:00","text":"你就說看報導，對吧？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:36.097000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:45.499000+08:00","text":"這個部分是你自費付了，因為都已經講過了，就不再贅述，但我們這裡想問，造成這麼大的輿論風波，卓院長會不會覺得不好意思？","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:46.397000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:50.542000+08:00","text":"我自己一個人默默的去，風波是你們造成的啊！","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:51.803000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:53.065000+08:00","text":"沒有，很多人在關心，沒有……","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:53.746000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:56.349000+08:00","text":"是你們一直在問東問西才造成風波的……","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:56.349000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:57.349000+08:00","text":"客觀的情況下知道……","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:56.910000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:19:58.772000+08:00","text":"我去跟回來，你知道嗎？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:19:58.892000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:20:12.703000+08:00","text":"你要知道，院長，您是公眾人物，這件事情報導出來了，就必須要有人去了解到底是不是用公帑是不是有用到松指部的停機坪，所以才會去了解。","quality":0.724},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:20:14.163000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:20:24.707000+08:00","text":"但你現有點像在反問我這個情況是我們造成的，可是要不是你是公眾人物，可能就沒有人會去注意了，不過你已經回答，這個議題到目前為止。","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:20:26.647000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:21:04.743000+08:00","text":"再來，因為這次美、以、伊戰爭的問題，我們看到臺灣因為能源的部分，燃氣目前發電的比例是達50%，但是我國液化天然氣99%是仰賴國外進口，隨著臺海局勢的升溫，若運輸交通被封鎖的話，天然氣的電力無法維持到12天，燃氣發電的部分會引發國家能源韌性的問題，這可能是最脆弱的一環，請問院長，這個部分如何能維持我國能源的韌性？","quality":0.838},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:21:12.553000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:21:31.196000+08:00","text":"這一次中東的情勢，我們從228當天就開始掌握所有的狀況，包括在那邊的國人、能源、在國內跟國人怎麼聯繫，我們都做了整體的盤點與研析，從外交部到交通部、到經濟部、到金管會、到財政部，全部……","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:21:32.662000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:21:58.199000+08:00","text":"是這一次而已，院長，你所說的是這一次而已，未來的情況之下，要繼續再問的是如果這個部分影響到4月，你說以4月可能沒有問題，可是影響到5月的部分，尤其現在還不只是因為卡達的因素，如果是中國做出封鎖的情況之下，不知道什麼時間會……萬一他真的封鎖起來，超過12天的話怎麼辦？","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:21:58.199000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:22:09.900000+08:00","text":"所以趕快把我們的能量壯大起來啊，如果我們有更強的國防體系的話，我們可以更及早建造更安全的國家，現在就是希望……所以……","quality":0.942},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:22:10.440000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:22:21.090000+08:00","text":"我們已經看到有這種狀況，所以我們趕快，今天不開始，明天就會來不及；今天趕快開始，就永遠可以有進步到我們必須安全保障自己的那天。","quality":0.982},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:22:21.451000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:22:25.254000+08:00","text":"能源韌性，沒有一個國家……能源韌性應該是多元的現在只剩下再生能源跟……","quality":0.567},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:22:25.254000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:22:26.795500+08:00","text":"當然我們都已經在做啊！","quality":0.1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:22:26.795500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:22:28.337000+08:00","text":"我們正在做多元的事情……","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:22:28.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:22:31.900000+08:00","text":"剛剛跟你說的3月、4月都沒有問題，就是韌性結果出來……","quality":0.81},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:22:32.280000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:23:35.843000+08:00","text":"我剛才說的還有包括臺海被封鎖，這是最重要的問題，看起來是沒有回答，還在用卡達的問題來處理，但臺灣更重要的問題是，包括美國的智庫CSIS去年8月份的時候最新兵推報告都顯示出來了，模擬共軍對臺海實施封鎖的時候，顯示臺灣在10天會耗盡天然氣的儲量，煤跟石油分別是在7週跟20週會耗盡，臺灣總發電量只剩下封鎖前的20%，屆時所有的製造業都會停擺，因為美國海軍情報指揮官Mike Studeman在聽證會上也提到說，臺灣至少要有一座核能電廠才能夠減輕能源供應被切斷的危機，這樣的情況，臺灣有沒有考慮針對暫時封鎖的情境，把核能作為一個穩定發展的來源，有考慮到嗎？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:23:35.843000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:23:37.164000+08:00","text":"請部長說明。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:23:37.164000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:23:49.822000+08:00","text":"報告委員，因為現在核能的部分，我們核三廠已經開始啟動自主安全檢查，3月份就會送出再運轉計畫，就是儘快的，因為在法律的授權之下……","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:23:49.842000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:23:51.323000+08:00","text":"你的儘快是不是像我的投影片所看到的情形，在2028年？","quality":0.476},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:23:51.323000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:23:52.323000+08:00","text":"如果按照你們現在時程，今年3月就提出嘛！","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:23:51.383000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:23:54.125000+08:00","text":"因為我們跟西屋公司已經簽約了，「儘快的」是要看它機組老化的情況，要汰換的設備是多還是少，如果汰換的設備都很好，不用汰換太多，時間就可以縮短，但是如果要汰換的比較多……","quality":0.781},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:24:15.418000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:24:21.540000+08:00","text":"所以有機會在平均大概兩年內的時間結束，有機會看實際狀況，對不對？","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:24:21.540000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:24:21.960000+08:00","text":"我們會儘快。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:24:21.960000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:24:23.021000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:24:23.021000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:24:45.529000+08:00","text":"另外，還有一個重要的非碳電力問題，因為經濟部能源署還一直堅守RE100，用100%的再生能來講，可是現在國際間科技企業界所採用的是24小時7天的無碳電力……","quality":0.921},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:24:46.350000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:24:51.153000+08:00","text":"報告委員，法規上沒有RE100，但是RE100是廠商自主的承諾。","quality":0.739},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:24:51.153000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:25:21.006000+08:00","text":"現在是國際間已經出現一大堆，等一下就會講到，目前我們再生能源的部分，到2025年只有378億度的電，但是未來依照每年還需要2.5%能源成長的話，預計到2030年將近要有大概900億度的電，900億度的電是再生能源喔！","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:25:21.547000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:25:26.949000+08:00","text":"但是如果說全部是3,000億度的電，3,000億度電是不是30%要再生能源？是吧！","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:25:27.968000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:25:30.610000+08:00","text":"現在還是照我們預估的……對！","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:25:30.991000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:25:34.713000+08:00","text":"就是20%的目標往前盡力地完成。對！","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:25:34.753000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:08.007000+08:00","text":"那我是算出來，因為我們這幾天一直在問能源署的官員們，結果幾天都沒有下來，因為用的是往再生能源的占比去加，那我們就來推啊，2.5%的成長率，到2030年預計就會有3,000億度的電要出現，30%就是900億度，可是2025年的時候就只有378億度電，現在再生能源已經跳票，原本預計今年要20%，事實上只有13到16點多%，自己都跳票了……","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:08.007000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:10.948000+08:00","text":"現在十五點多啦。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:10.948000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:13.949000+08:00","text":"沒有，現在事實上看到的最多到16%而已。","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:13.949000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:14.949000+08:00","text":"十五點多，對，平均。","quality":0.286},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:14.189000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:41+08:00","text":"那你現在20%已經跳票了，你預計2030年，現在只剩下4年時間，你要從378億度電變成900億度電，我預計打個折扣，大概成長1倍的話就是700億度，可能缺200億度，你如果還是沒有辦法達到RE100的情況，你這樣缺了200億度要從哪裡來？","quality":0.845},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:44.215000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:50.338000+08:00","text":"報告委員，不是所有的企業都承諾RE100，是有一些公司有承諾，現在以臺灣來講大概三十幾家，不是所有的企業。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:50.939000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:55.041000+08:00","text":"我們現在不只臺灣，輝達也要進來，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:55.721000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:26:57.742000+08:00","text":"美光也要進來，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:26:57.742000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:01.464000+08:00","text":"這些都是國際大廠，200億度電，而且你事實上就跳票了嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:03.125000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:06.927000+08:00","text":"300%再生能源的電力，就是沒有達到嘛，就是這樣子！","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:08.597000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:18.562000+08:00","text":"真的要請政府好好去考慮需要用到非碳的電力，不然2030年已經跳票的部分，已經沒有辦法達成。","quality":0.816},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:20.102000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:23.544000+08:00","text":"不是，我們綠能的推動工作還是持續進行，而且就像委員講我們要努力，我們會很努力！","quality":0.629},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:24.764000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:31.448000+08:00","text":"這部分會影響到我國吸引外資跟維持出口競爭力，請卓政府一定要好好去了解……","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:32.749000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:41.294000+08:00","text":"但是現在外資對臺灣的投資環境非常滿意，昨天agent來拜訪我，他說百分之九十幾的廠商會持續投資臺灣。","quality":0.894},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:42.588000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:50.052000+08:00","text":"但是現在的狀況是包括像輝達，包括AI的部分，曾文生董事長他說全球競爭力的部分……","quality":0.861},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:50.052000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:27:51.052000+08:00","text":"輝達也願意投資臺灣，而且還要加碼投資臺灣。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:27:50.432000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:04.581000+08:00","text":"就是需要有非碳電力，從現在看起來，經濟部跟卓政府事實上忽略我們臺灣對於全球淨零碳排目標的需求。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:04.661000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:06.522000+08:00","text":"我們沒有忽略，剛剛部長都講得很清楚啊！","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:07.622000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:08.483000+08:00","text":"2050年我們還是……","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:08.843000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:10.004000+08:00","text":"世界大廠還是有信心。","quality":0.556},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:10.224000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:13.866000+08:00","text":"你必須要一步一步的，你2030沒有達到，竟然可以跳到……真是太誇張。","quality":0.84},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:13.986000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:16.287000+08:00","text":"就是一步一步，一年一年往上追趕目標。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:16.708000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:27.174000+08:00","text":"好，接下來我們再講，在非碳電力當中，你剛才有講到核三廠現在已經提出自主安全報告，送到核安會去，對不對？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:27.174000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:29.785500+08:00","text":"3月底之前提交再運轉計畫。","quality":0.091},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:29.785500+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:28:32.397000+08:00","text":"3月底送去。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:28:32.397000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:29:01.784000+08:00","text":"剛才有提到預計是2028，如果安全設施都無虞，這些設備都安全的話，可能就會提早營運，現在還有一個問題，因為卓院長你一直提到核能的部分，再來有一個新式的核能機組，或是所謂的核融合的技術，現在有一個問題是在於……核融合的技術……你剛才應也問了別人，那是外聘的委員。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:29:01.784000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:29:06.165000+08:00","text":"我們都知道核融合的技術現在還在開發的階段、研發階段……是。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:29:06.165000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:29:09.226000+08:00","text":"沒有錯。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:29:09.226000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:29:32.284000+08:00","text":"最快最快到2030年中才具備商轉的可能性，這個部分，我剛才講到的所有數據，再生能源到2030年的時候就已經可能會跳票，剛才說缺200億度電，如果核三廠的168億度電用的話，其實在2年之後也可以補上這個缺口，就是一個很大的幫助。","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:29:33.526000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:29:55.025000+08:00","text":"可是剛才說SMR的部分，看起來政府對於SMR的考量，就好像畫一個大餅在未來，等於到2030年中才會出現，那你2030年到2030年中間之後的部分，可能在5年之內是沒有辦法把非碳電力補足。","quality":0.865},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:29:55.625000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:09.889000+08:00","text":"我們還是繼續推動二次能源轉型，除了多元發展綠能之外，我們的深度節能、科技儲能都會全面展開，另外，電網韌性也會加強，這都是在強化整個供電的系統。好。","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:09.889000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:10.629000+08:00","text":"所以是多元的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:10.729000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:13.270000+08:00","text":"我們離岸風電還是持續推動當中。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:13.270000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:26.895000+08:00","text":"這個部分我剛剛都有提到也有算過，因為你們30%……重點是卓院長說的這些部分都是該做的，可是國家最重要就是在多元的能源開源，請你要注意到這部分。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:26.895000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:27.895000+08:00","text":"是，剛剛我講的就是這樣。","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:27.895000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:28.895000+08:00","text":"都是在做這些。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:27.315000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:31.957000+08:00","text":"不然的話，SMR也沒有做，儲能、節能都應該做。","quality":0.789},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:32.618000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:48.645000+08:00","text":"我們再繼續往下看，還有一個議題有關拖吊蟑螂，跟你分享一個新聞，初六機車拖了2公里竟然索價5萬1,000元，到底是行情還是搶劫？","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:49.846000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:30:52.027000+08:00","text":"問題可能是制度很失靈喔！","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:30:53.308000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:31:33.386000+08:00","text":"上週本黨團也有開一個協調會，談到交通部只管國道跟快速道路的拖吊業，因為把它當作特許行業，由高公局來管理，但是一般的道路、市區道路的拖吊業卻交由地方政府進行，拖吊業並沒有納入到公路法的管理，導致大量拖吊的詐欺事件都是以消費爭議來處理，而且曠日廢時、民怨四起，數據顯示這兩、三年來成倍的申訴案件出現，警察說民事糾紛，他不敢介入，中央推地方、地方要給消保官制度處理。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:31:33.666000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:31:56.848000+08:00","text":"我想要問院長，我們檢視問題在於公路法當中並沒有把拖吊業者納管，如果沒有納管的話，他根本沒有辦法管理，甚至我們當初問交通部的專員，他說現在一般道路上到底有多少業者，大的、小的業者有多少他都說不清楚，因為沒有辦法管。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:31:57.508000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:32:02.913000+08:00","text":"重點想問的是公路法修法有沒有要把拖吊業者納入到公路法當中修法？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:32:04.780000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:32:23.523000+08:00","text":"跟委員先報告，等一下請部長說明，我們也跟委員一樣非常重視，尤其年節的時候，這種交通的拖吊會發生一種亂象，雖然中央、地方各有管轄不同的陸域，但是我們希望能有比較強大的管理規則，一定要把這些業者納進來管理。所以……","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:32:24.284000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:32:31.745000+08:00","text":"因為現在他沒有辦法納進來管理，它不是公路法上所稱的運輸業，所以它沒有納進來，我們要想辦法把它納進來管理，請部長說明。","quality":0.83},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:32:32.905000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:32:36.846000+08:00","text":"對，公路法為什麼把它當作運輸業？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:32:36.846000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:32:50.251000+08:00","text":"這就是應該要修法的部分，作為立法委員，我們就是在反映這樣的民意，因為公路法管的並不是運輸，公路法管的是所有在道路上面行駛的車子，尤其車子的部分，沒有一個……每個人都會遇到拖吊、拋錨，現在缺少管理，這就是必須納入的，部長，你的看法呢？","quality":0.569},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:32:51.651000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:33:38.101000+08:00","text":"報告委員，現在其實不是沒有法可以管，我們現在消費者保護的法令都可以管得到，只是執行上要怎麼執行，但委員，我知道您的質疑，所以我們現在正在努力，您剛剛有提到我們在公路（省道），或者是高速公路，我們其實管理得不錯，我們會以那個經驗來協助制定一個定型化契約，透過這樣子的定型化契約，來協助各個地方都有定型化契約出來之後，如果遇到消費上的糾紛，我們就可以依照這個定型化契約來處理，我們希望在今年年底之前可以完成這樣子的努力。","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:33:39.081000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:33:41.882000+08:00","text":"我們請部長來說明目前偵辦的狀況。部長……","quality":0.706},{"speaker":"鄭部長銘謙","start":"2026-03-10T11:33:42.123000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:33:50.866000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，春節期間拖吊蟑螂橫行的部分，臺北地檢署跟新北地檢署都有分案在偵辦中。","quality":0.946},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:33:51.607000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:34:12.830000+08:00","text":"好，這部分謝謝鄭部長，但是我的重點是卓院長、陳部長，您的問題是沒有看到重點，您受限於……沒錯，如果變成消費者的部分，像觀光業，甚至補教業，把它當作定型化契約管理，這是枝節啊！","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:34:13.571000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:34:40.584000+08:00","text":"根本的問題是本身就應該放在交通的公路法當中，或是相關……要有法源基礎去進行，如果沒有這部分去處理，甚至這部分還涉及到一般公路上的拖吊業者，剛才有說到，引起的是刑事犯罪、詐欺等等，這部分是非常重要的，竟然沒有法源基礎，你現在變成用消保法，這是枝節啊！","quality":0.928},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:34:41.665000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:34:55.611000+08:00","text":"報告委員，一般的市區道路裡面，管理規則本來就不太一樣，我舉個例，客運公車是運輸業，當然我們有公路法交通部也會納管，但在地方上的管理還是是由地方政府來執行，所以現在最關鍵的是……","quality":0.785},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:34:56.491000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:34:58.073000+08:00","text":"這就是問題啊！","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:34:58.634000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:03.041000+08:00","text":"因為22個縣市通通都有這個問題的時候，為什麼中央沒有辦法有統一的作法？","quality":0.871},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:03.481000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:09.029000+08:00","text":"我們現在就是要協助地方做定型化契約，我們希望每一個地方政府都能夠做得出自己的定型化契約。好。","quality":0.814},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:09.029000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:10.029000+08:00","text":"看得出來這其實是枝微末節的問題，因為拖吊車業是很重要的部分，必須要納入到公路法裡，看起來並沒有要支持的態度啦！","quality":0.059},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:10.029000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:11.029000+08:00","text":"沒關係，我們看到……","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:10.609000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:31.271000+08:00","text":"縣市所管道路上面發生的問題，有部分就是屬於地方自治事項，這個就是中央跟地方的層級……","quality":0.684},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:31.271000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:33.593000+08:00","text":"對，但是管理制度上面……","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:33.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:42.520000+08:00","text":"每一個地方都有問題的時候，我們會想辦法設一個法令，以讓大家能夠共同遵守，但是地方也可以自己有一個自治的法規，都是要這些層級來做的。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:43.021000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:51.768000+08:00","text":"我們看到了這個亂象，剛剛部長也說過了，正在準備要做強力納管的作為，你怎麼會說他都沒準備呢？","quality":0.927},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:51.768000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:35:52.768000+08:00","text":"這部分也許在修法過程中，我們可以繼續再溝通，因為……","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:35:52.188000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:36:09.998000+08:00","text":"我們現在在召集各個縣市，大家一起來共擬一個方案，但我們優先從高速公路跟省道，依他們管理的經驗，把定型化契約先訂出來作為一個範本，讓所有地方政府可以作為參考。好。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:36:10.994000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:36:17.439000+08:00","text":"我們希望在未來在修法的時候，朝野雙方能夠多一點溝通，看怎麼樣朝最能夠治本的方向處理，好不好？好。","quality":0.837},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:36:19.221000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:36:28.488000+08:00","text":"我們繼續往下看，另外一個問題是測速照相機，本來設置測速照相機應該是要降低車禍事故。","quality":0.816},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:36:29.648000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:36:43.692000+08:00","text":"事實上，臺灣測速照相機的密度是日本的三百多倍，而罰單數量是日本的3倍，但是交通死亡率卻是日本的5倍，全臺有超過2,500支的測速桿。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:36:44.732000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:36:56.555000+08:00","text":"如果超速是發生死亡車禍裡最大的原因，但最重要是因為駕駛人的疏忽等等，並沒有對症下藥。","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:36:57.256000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:37:02.617000+08:00","text":"從臺北市數據來看，包括是變換車道不當及駕駛疏忽等等。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:37:04.457000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:37:14.439000+08:00","text":"請問院長或部長，超速並非是交通事故主因的時候，目前廣設測速照相桿是什麼樣的意義？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:37:14.660000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:37:16.040000+08:00","text":"到底是在拚營收嗎？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:37:16.040000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:37:16.380000+08:00","text":"還在救命？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:37:16.380000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:37:17.380000+08:00","text":"我請部長說明。","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:37:16.980000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:37:35.516000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，您的這個數據跟我們這邊所掌握且真正研析之後的數據是不太一樣的，因為在車禍發生的第一時間，當然我們就是這樣登錄，沒有任何一個駕駛會承認自己是超速，所以在裡面大部分的人都會說：我是恍神、我是不小心。","quality":0.968},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:37:36.377000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:37:51.170000+08:00","text":"所以第一時間的登錄是這樣，但如果真正做整個車禍的測量或是研析之後，我們有發現因為車速過快造成的車禍高達4成到5成左右，各國的數據其實都差不多。","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:37:54.012000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:00.958000+08:00","text":"另外，您說臺灣有兩千多支的測速照相機，但我們的死亡率卻沒有像日本這麼低。","quality":0.848},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:01.598000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:11.046000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，其實車禍事故有很多的樣態，測速照相跟車禍不一定有必然關係，坦白這樣講。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:11.246000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:12.768000+08:00","text":"日本他們有沒有比較守法？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:12.908000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:13.848000+08:00","text":"有沒有超速得比較少？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:14.409000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:14.589000+08:00","text":"應該是有。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:15.290000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:30.322000+08:00","text":"也跟委員報告，臺灣的設置密度其實也沒有特別高，您剛剛所提到臺灣有兩千多支的測速照相機，但光是韓國在這幾年的交通改革非常成功，所以他們死亡率降非常快。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:30.762000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:46.807000+08:00","text":"但我也要跟委員報告，他們光是首爾市的測速照相機就超過2,000支，也就是大家依照速度管理下去，很合法、合規的駕駛，這是很正常的，也應該要做的，這對交通管理絕對是有幫助的。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:47.007000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:51.669000+08:00","text":"如果是這樣子的話，請向民眾說清楚。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:52.049000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:53.670000+08:00","text":"這部分的報告是不是也給本席一份？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:53.870000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:38:54.010000+08:00","text":"這個沒有問題。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:38:55.051000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:39:02.434000+08:00","text":"另外，測速照相機的設置與改善交通的效益及效果，你們有做報告嗎？","quality":0.893},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:39:02.514000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:39:04.275000+08:00","text":"有做研究嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:39:04.275000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:39:05.275000+08:00","text":"這是地方……","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:39:05.151000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:39:12.114000+08:00","text":"我跟委員報告，大部分的測速照相機都是地方政府在設置，包含那個罰款。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:39:12.674000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:39:23.559000+08:00","text":"我自己當過臺中市議員，我很清楚，我在審預算的時候，發現臺中市政府一年可以編二十幾億的罰款收入，這些收入都在地方政府，不是中央要去設置的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:39:23.719000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:39:31.428000+08:00","text":"但我只是跟委員報告，速度管理對於整個交通管理來講，降低死亡絕對是有幫助的。好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:39:31.828000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:39:36.511000+08:00","text":"我們希望能看到這份報告或是從地方政府拿到的報告。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:39:37.172000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:40:19.517000+08:00","text":"繼續往下看，全臺交通罰單的收入在前年大概就有300億元，現在根據道交條例跟道路交通違規罰鍰收入分配跟運用辦法可以看到這邊的錢，基本上如果以直轄市來講的話，75%給各縣市，然後其中12%才是用在改善交通設施，63%是配到一般地方政府使用，在內政部警政署這邊有17%分配予國道公路建設管理基金，重點是這些收到的錢能不能把它用在所謂的改善道路交通，而不是變成地方的財政收入？","quality":0.81},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:40:21.338000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:40:27.022000+08:00","text":"報告委員，這個部分我相當支持，因為我們是用違規的收入……違規為什麼要罰？","quality":0.871},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:40:27.022000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:41:01.197000+08:00","text":"是因為希望交通更安全，所以罰款的收入應該要來改善整體的交通安全狀況才是正道，目前我確實有看到一個現象，就是很多的地方政府把它變成是一個小金庫在使用，並不是真正拿來用在道路或者是安全改善，我是希望這個比例可以增加，我也請我們部內開始在研析這個問題，但這也涉及到整個財政收支的一些問題，包含財政紀律的問題，在之前有些法令上面的限制，我們希望能夠推動這方面的改革，也希望委員會支持。","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:41:01.197000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:41:03.440000+08:00","text":"這樣的改革，有沒有預計何時實現？","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:41:03.440000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:41:05.301000+08:00","text":"年底選舉又快到了，這部分……","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-03-10T11:41:05.602000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:41:17.910000+08:00","text":"我們年底之前能提出交通部期待的方案跟法案，但這也需要立法院這邊大家一起來幫忙，因為之前所設定的法令限制其實蠻多的，我們要一起來解套。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:41:18.430000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:41:20.691000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝陳部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:41:20.971000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:42:11.008000+08:00","text":"現在是關於役男體位區分標準修正草案的部分，我們看到這次在國防部跟內政部所合提出來，但是以國防部為主，這次體位區分標準的修正，把180種身心疾患從免役變成了徵召，標準比南韓還要嚴，想要問的第一個是在做行政函釋的時候，一般公告有關法令需要60天，這次只有45天，而且我聽到的是還沒有開公聽會，關於這個部分，院長，你是不是請誰去國防部說明為什麼違反原來的公告規定，延宕要做溝通跟說明以及開公聽會，以廣納各界意見？","quality":0.823},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:42:15.489000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:42:28.176000+08:00","text":"報告委員，有關於體位區分標準的修正，其實我們在1月底剛剛預告結束，在修正體位區分標準的過程當中，除了內政部、國防部，也有與衛福部一起商量跟討論。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:42:28.496000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:42:37.641000+08:00","text":"預告結束之後，確實有些團體有不同的意見，所以我們會把這個意見全部蒐整之後才公告，為什麼要做體位區分標準的部分？","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:42:37.741000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:43:03.207000+08:00","text":"是這樣子的，就是關於替代役的部分，如果跟其他國家相比，我們的免疫標準的是16%，包括南韓或其他的國家只有3%到6%而已，我們覺得有些人是為了逃避兵役，所以我們以修正體位區分標準來處理，同時也因應我們現在的兵役制度，從4個月延長到1年的期間，所以會有加嚴的標準出現。","quality":0.94},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:43:04.087000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:43:15.270000+08:00","text":"好，但是現在很重要的是包括了你們現在把一些……尤其是有些心理狀況的部分，我特別要講到是包括A、B體位到底是怎麼區分？","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:43:15.370000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:43:15.850000+08:00","text":"他們要怎麼樣訓練？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:43:15.850000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:43:19.771000+08:00","text":"因為都要進入到成功嶺做新兵的一個……訓練。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:43:19.771000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:43:34.979000+08:00","text":"基礎的一個體位、基礎的一個訓練，那我們可以看到特別是針對有些跨性別者，他們這部分依目前的草案是把免役改為替代役的A級，那替代役採取方式是怎麼樣？","quality":0.836},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:43:34.979000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:43:51.771000+08:00","text":"是採集體住宿，而且由男性化管理的模式，包含剪了極短的頭髮，用集體寢室跟共浴的安排，這對於有些接受荷爾蒙治療的跨性別女性而言，會表達很驚恐的性別否定跟身體暴露。","quality":0.863},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:43:52.412000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:43:59.704000+08:00","text":"面對這個情形，這部分有更進步的……也就是有沒有把這意見再納進來做修訂？","quality":0.903},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:43:59.704000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:44:01.205000+08:00","text":"是，謝謝委員的關心。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:44:01.585000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:44:17.509000+08:00","text":"有關於性別心理的特殊狀況部分，衛福部跟相關專業的精神醫學會，有得到一定程度的共識，也就是我們希望採取一年當中用持續追蹤的方式，來了解他是否適合服替代役。","quality":0.986},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:44:18.289000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:44:29.015000+08:00","text":"另外一個在我們替代役的訓練中心，以成功嶺為主的話，我們在所謂的跨性別友善的住宿環境會來做改善，這個部分我們持續跟公民團體保持……","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:44:29.035000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:44:31.976000+08:00","text":"可是如果要集體住宿，這種制度可以……","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:44:32.336000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:45:12.455000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我想您大概知道，以目前服兵役來看，連我們的常備兵……就是專業服兵役也有女兵，所以事實上，在性別友善的這個空間裡面，怎麼做比較好的修正，我覺得按照兵役法，因為服兵役是臺灣國民的義務，我們也應該朝著這方面來處理，但是我們現在有給所謂的性別心理狀態比較特殊的這些人，在申請的期間，會用一年的時間，採取每一個月或每兩個月，到專業的精神科醫師這邊做身心狀況的診斷來追蹤辦理，看他是不是符合免役標準。","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:45:13.115000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:45:16.678000+08:00","text":"好，這邊你們會繼續再追蹤就對了。對。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:45:16.999000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:45:40.277000+08:00","text":"另外，有關於不堪服兵役者，本來以前是當作免役，現在是行動不便者也需要他人照顧的，是這樣限縮，只要是一般四肢健全的，但是如果有心臟病、器官移植、僵直性脊椎炎等等，他沒有身障證明，好像還是繼續在裡面作息，就是可以變成替代役會被徵召等等。","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:45:41.198000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:45:50.684000+08:00","text":"我們過去看到一些替代役的部分，有個椎間盤突出的役男陳俊銘發生入伍後舊疾復發，還被認為是裝病，結果後來失去了生命。","quality":0.827},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:45:51.864000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:46:00.091000+08:00","text":"在這個問題上面，是不是能夠針對成功嶺當中的役男長期醫療資源不足的部分去做修訂？","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:46:00.091000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:46:20.073000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們這次修訂的範圍非常廣，193項，修訂了180項次，但是大家都知道，服替代役跟一般到國防部的單位去服役，是不太一樣的，譬如說，我們有家因替代役，也有產業替代役、社會替代役，也就是說他在成功嶺服26天這樣子的體能訓練之後……","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:46:20.073000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:46:26.599000+08:00","text":"部長，我剛才就是問成功嶺的問題，替代役役男陳俊銘就是在入伍後才……","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-03-10T11:46:27.400000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:46:38.230000+08:00","text":"好，如果說在成功嶺裡面有這樣子不健全或者是有受到不安全的狀況之下，請來告訴我們，我們來做一下檢討跟修正。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:46:38.902000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:46:44.209000+08:00","text":"好，最後一個問題就是想到的是一個，我們這次看到的是……兩位部長請回。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:46:47.194000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:47:18.883000+08:00","text":"卓院長，您在這次的施政報告中有特別提到，有一個兒少的發展專戶，這個帳戶將從弱勢就是從原來107年的部分，有要把它擴大的意思，我們看到你有這樣的用心，但是這個兒少帳戶的適用對象是有意要從弱勢兒童擴展到全部的兒少或是新生兒嗎？","quality":0.901},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:47:18.883000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:47:32.610000+08:00","text":"因為我們從國民年金、老農津貼，一直到最近討論的六大生活補助，我們認為應該更完善地對青少年朋友們，從生育、養育到教育有一整套的計畫。","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:47:32.610000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:47:58.461000+08:00","text":"所以，過去的兒少專帳面對的是低收、中低收入戶，執行的成果有限，我們如果要擴大、要普遍化的話，能不能在財政考量之下，做一個更普遍性、周延性，把對象擴大、金額合理，讓他能夠在人生的不同階段，有自己可以自主性的一筆、一開始的一個小小的財源。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:47:58.461000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:47:59.488000+08:00","text":"卓院長，你在你的施政報告當中講到，如果新生兒出生的話，第一筆一次就10萬，我看到這個數據。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:47:59.488000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:01.872000+08:00","text":"這個我們現在已經做到了，就是補到10萬元，未來我們隨著各種條件，還可以增加，我想說的是人生的第一桶金。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:01.892000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:20.497000+08:00","text":"好，這部分跟我們在野黨1月份所提出來的臺灣未來帳戶，事實上是蠻有相近的意圖在。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:20.577000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:22.119000+08:00","text":"但是要考慮到國家財政的能力。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:22.980000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:25.783000+08:00","text":"對，我知道反正到時候都是會排進來審嘛，對不對？好。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:25.883000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:31.949000+08:00","text":"我想這部分是不是大家有共識之後，往這個地方，為我們的下一代，尤其新生兒的出生率發展，繼續再做努力。好的。","quality":0.696},{"speaker":"劉委員書彬","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:32.049000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:32.390000+08:00","text":"OK，就這樣，謝謝院長，謝謝部長。","quality":0.538},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:32.390000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:33.390000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:32.390000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:32.610000+08:00","text":"謝謝劉書彬委員的質詢，謝謝卓院長、相關部會首長的備詢，謝謝。","quality":0.346},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:33.110000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:42.252857+08:00","text":"報告院會，在議場二樓旁聽的是來自林倩綺委員嘉義的親友團，掌聲歡迎大家。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-10T11:48:42.552857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-10T11:48:50.552857+08:00","text":"我們接下來再請今天上午最後一位質詢的委員賴瑞隆委員，請質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}