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對就是在Google Microsoft Amazon跟Apple AMD這些來講他們可能還不只是要滿足RE1000他可能還要再往247的CFE這邊來做所以有些大廠的設置的時候可能會把這個考慮進去那這樣子可能會延緩他們的設置所以經濟部的話可能要做一個判斷"},{"start":345.299,"end":350.432,"text":"就是我到底要不要來那來了之後我這些東西要怎麼去補他們的需求"},{"start":351.689,"end":376.174,"text":"這個區分為兩個部分所以對於重大的這個投資不管是水電或是土地的部分其實經濟部都有定場的去做一個檢討還有包括滾動式的去談說我想不耽誤各位的時間就是最後請經濟部幫我說一個就是說現在目前用電的需求那尤其要考量到我們的AI Data Center這些國際大廠"},{"start":377.594,"end":396.82,"text":"未來的需求的成長台電有預估也在我們電力可告訴的分析裡面我們在2034年我們可以提供12.2GW的這個的電力那另外就是綠電的部分好不好再送給我一個報告好不好這個都可以滿足到我們未來的那你可以交報告出來喔好謝謝謝謝我們會提供資料好謝謝好謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:19:43.231000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:19:46.635000+08:00","text":"有請經濟部賴次長、台電許永輝副總。","quality":0.733},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-18T12:19:50.078000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:19:53.782000+08:00","text":"請經濟部、台電上臺，謝謝。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:19:53.782000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:19:54.043000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:19:58.797000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:20:54.008000+08:00","text":"根據再生能源發展條例第六條第一項的規定，基本上再生能源我們有另外的規劃，就是114年它的發電設備目標總量大概是2,700萬千瓦的綠電，但是我們統計到114年年底的時候，實際的容量大概只有2287.2萬千瓦，所以中間相差了412.8萬千瓦的缺口，換算下來大概是70到90億度，基本上來講大概接近一座台積電南科廠或者是半個竹科這樣子的缺口，以這樣子的缺口來講，請問政府打算用什麼樣的能源來補？","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:20:57.726000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:21:01.629000+08:00","text":"剛剛委員所提到的數據，我可能會後再請同仁跟委員接洽一下。","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:21:02.190000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:21:14.039000+08:00","text":"根據我們掌握的數據，以去年的調查，綠電的需求是243億度，我們的供給是446億度的電。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:21:14.680000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:21:26.079000+08:00","text":"就今年最新的調查，even 2026年的需求是252億度，而我們可供給的量是532億度的電。","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:21:26.079000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:21:37.423000+08:00","text":"所以無論是去年、今年或是在2030年以前，我們有具體的目標讓綠電的供給可以滿足企業的需求。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:21:38.023000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:21:52.689000+08:00","text":"我們從幾個方向來看多元綠能的發展，比如今年離岸風電就可以併網到5.3GW，而我們今年也會公布3-3的遴選方式。","quality":0.894},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:21:53.709000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:03.074000+08:00","text":"除此之外，無論是地熱、小水力或是太陽能光電，我們都有具體的計畫在執行之中。","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:03.354000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:04.795000+08:00","text":"所以我們的綠電是夠的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:05.535000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:07.956000+08:00","text":"我們現在努力在達成我們……","quality":1},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:07.956000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:09.337000+08:00","text":"夠或不夠？","quality":1},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:09.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:10.338000+08:00","text":"我剛剛講的是夠的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:14.213000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:35.090000+08:00","text":"基本上來講，因為我們一直下修，就是占20%的綠電到2022年一直下修到15.1%，然後我們估計到2025年大概是13.1%，這樣子的預估到底是不是因為達不到目標值，所以一直往下修？","quality":0.838},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:36.045000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:44.308000+08:00","text":"我們訂定一個比較積極的目標，當時訂了這個積極的目標，我們的同仁也非常努力要朝這個目標去趕進。","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:46.128000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:22:59.073000+08:00","text":"以太陽能光電為例，社會有很多的關注，不幸的是，去年在立法院修改通過了用比較嚴格的標準，所以讓我們很多的太陽能在施工中或是……","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:22:59.633000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:23:09.398000+08:00","text":"嚴格的標準並不是不好，因為你如果光電板亂設、漁電共生亂搞，對於農地等等的破壞，對我們也是……","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:23:10.098000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:23:28.431000+08:00","text":"其實我們也不希望有這些狀況發生，所以我們太陽能光電的申設不斷在優化，不管是景觀或是生態的優化，甚至我們跟法務部都有成立相關的平臺作業，去遏止委員所關心的這些不正常現象。","quality":0.899},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:23:29.712000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:23:41.442000+08:00","text":"好，因為目標訂了，當然是要努力達成，所以可能在政策的滾動修正上，基本上也要回過頭去跟全國民眾再做一個比較清楚的說明。","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:23:45.445000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:24:16.747000+08:00","text":"我們在看這件事情的時候，基本上我們也估算出來了，照道理來講，我們的再生能源假設增加1.3%，核能降了差不多3.09%，但是這中間可能因為核能的停止，而再生能源補不到將近一半，基本上就必須靠燃煤、燃氣這種火力發電來補，這個時候會造成廠商一個很大的困擾，也就是碳稅和碳費的增加。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:24:17.667000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:24:45.463000+08:00","text":"所以我希望針對這一個部分，當然還是希望你們努力趕上再生能源發電比例，也希望核電在核三重啟安全評估之後，可以如同……昨天我跟台電董事長在談，他們也期待是不是可以快一點來補這樣的缺口，當然這還是要經過核安的檢查評估。","quality":0.908},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:24:47.224000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:24:48.424000+08:00","text":"為什麼我會這樣談？","quality":1},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:24:48.424000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:25:24.412000+08:00","text":"因為將來臺灣還有很多AI的算力中心、data的center，另外他們也要求……以Google、Microsoft、Amazon、Apple、AMD來講，他們可能還不只是要滿足RE100，他可能還要再往24/7CFE這邊來做，所以有些大廠在設置的時候，可能會把這個考慮進去，這樣子可能會延緩他們的設置，所以經濟部可能要做一個判斷，就是他們到底要不要來，來了之後，這些東西要怎麼去補他們的需求？","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:25:25.689000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:25:39.712000+08:00","text":"這區分為兩個部分，對於重大的投資，不管水電或是土地的部分，其實經濟部都有定常去做檢討，還有包括滾動式的去談……","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:25:39.712000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:25:50.174000+08:00","text":"我想不耽誤各位的時間，最後請經濟部幫我送一份資料，就是把目前用電的需求，尤其要考量到我們的AI Data Center這些國際大廠的需求……","quality":0.873},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:25:51.594000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:00.837000+08:00","text":"對於AI未來需求的成長，台電有預估，也在我們電力可靠度的分析裡面，我們在2034年可以提供12.2GW的電力……","quality":0.841},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:26:01.517000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:04.918000+08:00","text":"另外就是有關綠電的部分，再送給我一份報告好不好？","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:26:05.138000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:06.699000+08:00","text":"這個都可以滿足到我們未來的成長需求。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:26:07.539000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:08.479000+08:00","text":"你可以交報告出來嗎？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-03-18T12:26:09.800000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:10.520000+08:00","text":"謝謝，我們會提供資料給委員。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"洪委員毓祥","start":"2026-03-18T12:26:10.660000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:10.800000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-18T12:26:11.300000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:15.585714+08:00","text":"謝謝洪毓祥委員的質詢，官員請回座。","quality":0.133},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-03-18T12:26:15.885714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-03-18T12:26:19.314286+08:00","text":"下一位有請蔡春綢委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}