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申就業提薪資凡地方是我們當初提出的三項重要的未來檢驗的指標那為了落實這個均衡台灣我想國發會在去年九月又通過一個南科沙崙生態科學園區那還有那個之前新聞稿也都有提到這些"},{"start":149.023,"end":170.484,"text":"預估這個年產值會有兩兆多而且提供三萬五千個就業機會再加上院長您三月底有宣布的那個南科產值可以破四兆我想這些院警都非常棒我也非常的支持啦這總是為我們台灣好但是我還是要替宜蘭鄉親問一句話大南方有新矽谷有3.5萬個就業機會那我們宜蘭呢我們宜蘭有什麼"},{"start":171.885,"end":199.885,"text":"同樣是科學園區我先跟三位報告一下在2026年3月的統計宜蘭科的土地出租率是98.21銅鑼園區71%然後宜蘭70公頃的總面積出租率卻只有40.96所以這個連一半都不到這是一個現實存在的問題所以院長你們的均衡台灣似乎忘了宜蘭也需要被大家看見被大家照顧被大家所記得"},{"start":200.746,"end":219.094,"text":"所以國發會有對於南科的砂輪園區這個我們南部次資1227億有喊出年產值兩兆多啦有三萬五千多了那宜科已經核定20多年了目前這個產值目標就業目標或招商KPI請問一下院長有沒有什麼想法"},{"start":219.773,"end":248.852,"text":"我首先跟委員報告均衡台灣不是複製不是把任何所有東西複製成一樣比如我們在中部就是精密智慧新核心參著當地多年來的發展宜蘭是一個非常特別的我常常在宜蘭跟鄉親們說宜蘭未來它不僅是首都區黃金狼帶北北基宜它甚至要跟花東的慢活城鄉連在一起它可以假香港最它不僅科技發展"},{"start":250.373,"end":275.52,"text":"觀光 產業 文化 農業它都要發展在裡面而且宜蘭的科學園區已經納入這個新竹科學園區同樣在範圍當中來管理院長你說這個我都認同啦我都認同但是我要提的一個就是說那到底現在宜蘭這個地方科學園區它到底它的規劃是什麼它的定位是什麼它的產業戰略是什麼"},{"start":276.44,"end":294.549,"text":"這個我們完全看不到啊那還有一個 有一個好 那我先繼續提一個好了啦宜科新建第三期標準廠房中長期個案計畫有一個總經費24.44億預計118年底可以完工這個事情我不知道三位知不知道"},{"start":296.673,"end":314.064,"text":"這整個六大產業生活區由國發會來提出所以整個內容計畫國發會裡面有相當完整的一個說明但我們是逐步推動像桃竹苗大溪谷是第一個核定的那現在六個都核定了我們就逐步的推動院長您談遠了我就講一個最簡單"},{"start":315.945,"end":328.171,"text":"我跟您報告一下就是說我們對於那個宜蘭的規劃基本上有兩個方向一個是生技科學園區也就是說我們要去發展所謂的智慧醫療那另外一個就是往觀光的這個部分發展就好像剛剛院長講的宜蘭會是吃雙頭水"},{"start":330.973,"end":357.845,"text":"一個是會接我們的首都黃金兩代另外一個是接花東的慢火所以我們其實對宜蘭的建設其實最重要的一點就是說我們要去開發宜蘭的交通建設所以對於整個高鐵延伸到宜蘭的話我們國發會其實是蠻支持這樣你們還是談遠了我講一個簡單的就是說我一直希望知道我們宜科到底就業目標"},{"start":358.525,"end":377.666,"text":"招商KPI產業價值目標等等產業的戰略是什麼剛剛確實那個院長有提到一些啦那我剛有提到一個這第三期新建計畫這個部分啊我再看一下前面我剛講的它的土地原本的部分原始舊有的部分土地出租率只有40.9多那"},{"start":378.687,"end":405.678,"text":"建物的部分出租也只有七成出頭也就將近三成的建物現在也沒有人成租土地還有六成沒有人租用但是我們現在要搞一個第三期的興建計畫當然我沒有反對第三期興建計畫我沒有反對但是呢你們有沒有把目標放在來現有的硬體已經處理好了但是它招商效果並不好啊那大家有沒有注意到這個問題啊因為我擔心我們到時候蓋出來變蚊子館"},{"start":407.819,"end":425.655,"text":"還是回答你的問題就是說整個產業要發展的話地方的交通還是一個非常重要的因素所以我們一直在推所謂的那一個高鐵要延伸到宜蘭這個部分所以我們也希望就是說這一個計畫能夠順利的完成然後再帶動所謂的宜蘭三科的發展"},{"start":426.397,"end":440.723,"text":"你說的這個交通這個我們一直在推動不只高鐵還有台六十二線等等很多議題我們這段時間都一直在拜託能夠趕快處理但是我的問題還是在這邊因為我現在看到的是只有建築計畫我們要第三"},{"start":441.743,"end":458.372,"text":"第三期然後我們要蓋多少房子我們要花24.44億去蓋硬體但是我們舊有的廠房他的幾級舊有的土地的出租率還是偏低我剛剛說我剛拿銅鑼拿其他地方科學園區來比別人都到90幾了我們這邊只有"},{"start":460.473,"end":476.843,"text":"土地只有4層然後建物只有7層那這個部分我並沒有看到一個比較有效果的一個招商當然你可以講說這個是竹科管理局國科會在管的這個不是我管的但是我要跟各位報告不管怎麼樣今天在場的院長或者是部長"},{"start":478.104,"end":506.43,"text":"招商跟經濟的策略一定也是你們所狹下嘛但是我並沒有看到這個部分啦所以我想請教一個問題啦既然你們有這個第三期的這個廠房的這個個案的計畫那我想請問一下那你們有沒有思考到將來要引進什麼產業要創造什麼就業要達到什麼樣的程度三年內出租率要達到多少有沒有哪個部會可以跨部會的管考這幾個東西可不可以給我們一個數據"},{"start":508.03,"end":531.815,"text":"在這裡跟委員報告就像我剛剛跟委員報告就是說我們希望宜蘭是發展所謂的生技智慧醫療還有一個就是觀光這個部分所以我們其實有規劃很多譬如說在宜蘭那一邊我們會開始推動所謂的划船這個部分的一些運動就好像早上那個林倩琦委員也在也在一直推動就是說要推動所謂的那個水上一些活動"},{"start":535.896,"end":560.639,"text":"科學園區我不是在談觀光不是在談什麼我想那個當然也是很重要但是我還是聚焦在科學園區那我想請問一下你們國發會認為的北北基宜黃金狼帶215公頃11.4萬個就業機會那這個餅這麼大那請問一下宜蘭可以切多少大概多少是屬於宜蘭這一塊北北基宜四個那宜蘭大概是佔多少"},{"start":560.899,"end":576.095,"text":"因為我們是在整體規劃我們沒有辦法就是說分一個很特定的數目字給宜蘭那我們希望每一個地方都能夠蓬勃高漲而且是超過這個數字你這個答案給我就是一樣我的質疑也是沒有錯就是我並沒有聽到一個"},{"start":577.051,"end":586.742,"text":"有可以for宜蘭來怎麼做 你有整體效益 你有整體效益但是你沒有宜蘭的效益你有總就業啊 但是我還是沒有看到宜科的就業啊"},{"start":598.334,"end":612.123,"text":"那有種規模但是我還是需要地方的KPI我必須對宜蘭的鄉親我能夠論述給他聽我要幫政府辯護我也要講出一個東西給他聽可是目前我只看到您說的整體效益215公頃11.4萬個就業機會但是"},{"start":616.926,"end":635.612,"text":"在地的人只問我一個那一顆可以分多少我講不出來我只能跟他們講一個最大規模但是個別小部分特定部分我講不出來所以我只能講我只看到一個大餅但是這個餅要怎麼切我只有看到口號也沒有KPI這是我現在頭痛的部分"},{"start":636.172,"end":662.443,"text":"所以這個計畫北北基宜雖然把宜蘭包進來但是在執行上面我還是看不懂宜蘭可以怎麼做可不可以給委員一個建議最近一兩個禮拜以來我碰到幾位我們立法會的委員包括何信淳委員 陳書悅委員他們在跟我們談地方建設他們都有對地方很獨特深入的產業看法他們提出之後中央會跟他對接"},{"start":663.243,"end":689.181,"text":"他們不會說 他說不出來 他不知道他都有清楚的輪廓把中央的產業 六大區域產業事務區加入他自己對地方的產業需求這樣才能夠形成那這位委員能不能提出您對宜蘭有什麼想法那我想就是說因為我剛剛還是沒有聽到比較精確的數字跟未來的一個想法所以這部分我還是必須要提醒"},{"start":691.403,"end":711.351,"text":"畢竟我們現在經濟部手上還是有很多的武器比如說我們有租稅的工具我們有投資服務產創條例中小企業數位轉型資源等等的甚至我們還有提到一個五大信賴的產業的政策等等我們有這些東西所以我想請教一下三位有沒有把"},{"start":713.312,"end":737.891,"text":"這個宜科列入首都黃金狼帶裡面這有關這個人工智慧資安啊 次世代通訊這些招商的節點你們有做過去媒合這些廠商了嗎有沒有開始做這些了我們這個數位轉型補助啊那個是所有的中小企業有需要我們都會協助那我們也有這個分區的輔導團在做服務那我跟您補充一下因為剛剛國發會提到的就是"},{"start":740.368,"end":761.777,"text":"將來儀科的部分可能生醫或生技是很重要的重點那過去來講生醫生技主要是在南港還有竹北但是那邊都已經滿了所以他將來在儀科有很大的發展空間為什麼要有標準廠房因為就這些生醫科技的人他不需要很大的評測也不需要自己"},{"start":766.681,"end":776.648,"text":"所以我剛剛一直說我不反對第三期我沒有反對我只是說前面就有的招商的部分並沒有那麼漂亮的數據"},{"start":777.649,"end":804.89,"text":"我當時提這個我也沒有反對你們第三期的部分因為當然我知道有一些重要重大的一些產業他本來就有一些特定廠房的需求這塊我沒有意見但是請注意一下舊的廠房部分招商還是盡量協助管理局他們能夠把它做好我的目的只是這樣我並不是來指責誰怎麼樣好那我再請教一下就對於這個宜科第三期有沒有曾經開過那個跨部會的會議去談那個目標產業跟目標廠商有沒有曾經談過"},{"start":806.504,"end":832.752,"text":"我沒有參加但是我相信國科會應該會有跨部會如果有的話資料給我們一份有的話就是剛剛這兩個問題有的話資料給我一份那請問一下有沒有設定就是三年內這個宜科大概可以增加多少的就業機會能夠導入多少廠商能夠把出租率能夠拉高到多少有沒有這個想法我相信一定有我會後一併請國科會那就會後一併提供給我剛剛這三個問題"},{"start":835.193,"end":853.599,"text":"因為畢竟這個出租率真的還是稍微低了一些啦相較於其他的科學園區那我再請教一下因為你們現在有推一個數位轉型補助就是30人以下的製造業跟服務業這個數位轉型賠利那我想請問一下那目前宜蘭在地的產業有沒有人申請這個東西這個"},{"start":855.663,"end":878.04,"text":"有沒有這個補助我要回去check一下但是我剛剛跟您報告過就是說我們會有主動的這個輔導團分成四區啦那宜蘭在裡面我們也會主動的包括在地的有一些工業園區或工商團體我們都會跟他接洽那我會整理資料給您那這樣就是那還是一樣再給我資料因為我今天問的"},{"start":879.341,"end":900.311,"text":"比較細沒有錯啦但是我現在沒有得到答案就麻煩你們再給我所以我還是希望一個啦就是說我希望說經濟部能夠找這個國科會啊國發會能夠對於這個宜蘭第三期這宜科三期這個到底目標產業是什麼目標廠商然後就會KPI出租啊等等這個管考等等至少你三個月內你能夠把這個"},{"start":901.132,"end":915.234,"text":"書面給我一下我才能夠幫你們辯護嘛告訴地方的鄉親我們政府為了他們做什麼我想這個再麻煩你們一下好那再來我再提一個東西就是因為之前我們的院長曾經公開說"},{"start":916.756,"end":934.951,"text":"算力就是國力那個院長曾經提過這個我也非常的認同這個而且這是未來世界產業的走向那我在這邊跟各位報告我還是覺得啦就是矽光子這個東西真的是我們宜蘭未來翻身的一個完美的解方我想提出幾個重點但第一個就是說"},{"start":936.352,"end":964.018,"text":"就是說他主要仰賴這個數位服務跟資安研發主要是仰賴這些光纖跟矽光子所以他不用再繞過交通沒有血稅塞車等等的問題再來台北其實也比較飽和了租金也比較昂貴但我們宜蘭其實像剛剛我們說的有很多工業區的土地還是沒有租出去所以說其實宜蘭真的很適合是大台北科技狼帶的一個數位外溢的節點真的可以移到宜蘭去"},{"start":967.493,"end":985.047,"text":"這個包括後台基地等等都可以還有一個就是說其實是符合宜蘭人想要的一個環保需求因為這些東西都是比較屬於低碳排、低污染的這個部分想麻煩這邊一個建議三位不用回答這是一個建議麻煩說能夠盡量幫我們去思考這個部分"},{"start":986.268,"end":1012.805,"text":"再來就是說其實我們一直講說AI是五大信賴產業然後我們也講的均衡台灣所以我還是真的希望要把宜科放進去真的給我相關的數據我真的很希望得到因為目前我都還沒有查到足夠的數據能夠讓我理解我也想請各位看看其實我們台積電在美國的鳳凰城跟日本的熊本"},{"start":1013.926,"end":1030.047,"text":"我看到很多例子就是真正的招商不是蓋完廠房等廠商很多時候政府主動造了一個局然後廠商他就會很希望到那個地方來發展所以我這邊有提了幾個建議的點那當然這幾個"},{"start":1030.968,"end":1047.577,"text":"策略也是有去詢問過一些相關產業的他們給我們的一些比較專業的建議那我們希望說有五個我們就簡單唸出來然後請看一下PPT我們希望說能夠引進一個那個苗點的企業不要廠商都只是一些零星的廠商"},{"start":1048.237,"end":1070.1,"text":"他還是必須要整個產業鏈贏過去那才有意義所以我們希望能夠打包整個供應鏈那邊成為一個生態系而不是說東一個西一個零星的廠商那還有一個我們希望打造人才的工廠希望說在宜蘭推動半導體矽光子或一些資安在地培訓的一些課程等等因為我們希望廠商"},{"start":1071.181,"end":1092.507,"text":"需要到那邊設廠但是我們人才希望比廠商先到位來方便那些廠商不要讓企業到了找不到人才還有一個完善生活機能再來我們還是希望中央要能夠親自造這個局讓大家能夠過上好日子否則宜科永遠都只是一個邊緣的園區這是我們很擔心的一個點"},{"start":1094.449,"end":1100.68,"text":"畢竟你看那個矽光子的產業鏈它已經形成那種跨企業的聯盟超過150多個夥伴這個狀況之下"},{"start":1104.588,"end":1131.394,"text":"為什麼中央對宜科還沒有一個比較對接的地圖出來我一直覺得這是對宜蘭的一個很好的機會真的麻煩三位長官能夠多幫忙這塊我們把它達成所以我還是希望就是國發會這邊可不可以找經濟部國科會和那個宜蘭縣府我們就是就這個宜蘭園區的就是AI跟矽光子這個招商有沒有一個補救的一個方案"},{"start":1132.113,"end":1148.405,"text":"你看那三個月內能夠給我一個初步的也可以至少讓我了解一下我未來的狀況好不好在這個部分跟委員報告一下就是說台灣不是每一個地方都適合蓋經原廠因為蓋經原廠有它的土有一個土地有一個需要所以可能會綜合評估啦"},{"start":1151.867,"end":1179.258,"text":"所以我說我要的是評估並不是說你給我做這件事我的立場是這樣我不是不講理的人但是就是麻煩你們要給我一個評估看看這個有沒有什麼補救方案不行的話我們就告訴人民客觀上不行可以的話我們就盡量做到這是我的一個想法我還是希望就是說了解宜科到底在我們首都圈的黃金狼帶能扮演什麼樣的角色還有未來年輕人他們能做什麼"},{"start":1179.938,"end":1194.451,"text":"因為我現在不能要求說這些年輕人留在宜蘭是靠他的熱忱或是拿他的未來來賭嘛賭賭看在宜蘭有沒有機會我不希望他們留在宜蘭是這樣我希望他們是覺得留在宜蘭是有尊嚴的那對未來是有希望的啦"},{"start":1195.111,"end":1218.702,"text":"好那下一個我想是一個老問題這個是因為我在3月3號的時候當時的總諮詢我有提出兩個東西要麻煩行政院回覆但回覆的結果我並沒有達到我能夠對我的一些懷疑的點示意第一個就是說因為我們在談那個台美對等貿易協議這老問題ART的部分我一直提到一個點"},{"start":1219.502,"end":1246.608,"text":"如果當美國違反的時候因為這是一個雙項條款嘛對不對那這個雙項條款如果美國違反我們能怎麼做我當時問出這個問題我也講出條文結果呢行政院回給我了他就把條文抄一抄再給我可是我當時質詢我已經把條文講完啦我並不是要跟你們要條文我只是說萬一發生這個狀況我們台灣好像吃虧了那政府的反制的SOP是什麼但是我沒有拿到所以這個部分"},{"start":1247.368,"end":1266.745,"text":"我希望行政院還是能夠回覆給我所有的企業都要看這個狀況因為美國的任何一個作為我們台灣都可能有企業會受影響所以是不是可以把SOP這個啟動的流程要怎麼做你談對等對等這兩個字的時候你要怎麼做必須公告給國內的產業界知道這個東西麻煩必須告訴我"},{"start":1271.38,"end":1294.54,"text":"那譬如說美國現在已經對我們啟動301調查那我們要怎麼樣回應等等的那將來是不是有一些狀況如果有一個不對等狀況發生是不是經貿辦公室要先啟動調查收集情報提報行政院再由財政部或誰經濟部去做一些相關的反制措施是不是有這個流程麻煩行政院給我上一次質詢我已經有提過"},{"start":1295.7,"end":1304.125,"text":"但是我並沒有得到回覆院長這部分再麻煩你301的調查美國不是針對台灣是對世界上我不是問3014月28號會開始進行強迫勞動的公聽會5月5號會進行產能過量的公聽會公聽會之後"},{"start":1316.852,"end":1332.061,"text":"結束之後的七天內我們就可以把我們要回覆或是我們要申訴我們要強調的理由再回去這個就是一個程序問題我再講一次不要把話題扯遠了我不是在問這個我只是在問一個如果有不對等的狀況發生我們這裡要怎麼啟動一個SOP"},{"start":1335.723,"end":1361.324,"text":"程序當中在程序上必須是對等他有問我們有答我們也有時間來強調重複我們的實在的訴求沒問題啊 院長 您說的我都聽到再來就進到實質再去內容的問題了好 那個我跟你講我還是一個簡單麻煩給我怎麼啟動運作模式就好了我現在不是為個案好不好好 第二個我當時有提到一個點因為你們當時有做找智庫做了一些衝擊的評估嘛"},{"start":1362.725,"end":1383.294,"text":"那我當時有跟你們問說是哪一個智庫它的模型是什麼它的數據是什麼來源是什麼情境怎麼設定當場也跟我說會回覆給我全文也可以給我結果後來我什麼都沒看到那時候問的時候還有人跟我說這個智慧財產權我說國家做東西國會要這哪來的智慧財產權的 著作權的問題我們有回文"},{"start":1386.755,"end":1414.22,"text":"但是我沒有看到這些資料哪一些智庫我到現在還不知道我現在完全不知道更嚴重的是很多東西我們都是從美國代表組他的事實清單我們才看到所以我們很多東西譬如說我們跟美國以後的相處美國很多車子機械藥品肉品農產品等等的他們進到台灣他可能是低關稅甚至會不會是零關稅都有可能嘛"},{"start":1414.56,"end":1441.617,"text":"那這個東西我們都不知道啊那你們雖然回到台灣來講得很好聽說我們爭取到15%不疊加232最優惠等等你們講的這些沒有錯口話都很好聽我們人民也知道我們必須拿一些東西去交換但是至少讓我們知道我們拿了什麼去交換那我們有什麼東西將來要因應嘛還有一個譬如說那個SSG的問題啦那我們是放棄SSG嘛那將來"},{"start":1442.958,"end":1466.505,"text":"放棄之後呢 本來這個SG它是一個農產品的安全法進口量突然暴增 價格被打太低它還可以有一個額外的保護 但這個我們也都放棄了這個是不是也要讓農民能夠更清楚一點知道這些狀況不然會不會以後很多問題發生了 人民才在那邊痛苦那農漁民傳產要怎麼生活 其實這是我一直很擔心的"},{"start":1467.765,"end":1478.587,"text":"我簡單的講我從美國那邊的文件看到就是說台灣讓美國的貨更容易進到台灣我看到的是這樣然後呢"},{"start":1479.775,"end":1505.155,"text":"我們的立法委員在國會本來是代表全民監督政府結果我們現在得到的資訊必須要自己去看美國的資料我們國家反而是蓋起來不給大家知道我是覺得這個不是一個民主國家該有的樣貌很多人只是告訴人民說我們一切都好我們談得非常漂亮但是內容是什麼 人民其實都不是很清楚"},{"start":1505.836,"end":1526.594,"text":"好那所以剛剛這個就是麻煩一下剛剛我提到的雙項條款怎麼啟動這個能夠給我回覆一下第二個智庫的名單全文還有分析模型數據能夠給我一下讓我來參考就好麻煩因為這是我在上一次總諮詢我就提出來要請你們做但沒有做好這邊就麻煩可以嗎可以給我這兩個資料嗎"},{"start":1528.735,"end":1556.167,"text":"好 如果不涉及這個我剛才講的他們營業秘密的話我們提供給你可是放心啦我個人對營業秘密對國家機密我從來不會去要這個東西我也都跟我的辦公室同仁說國家機密的東西不可以去要這個沒有必要的情況下不可以去要國家機密的東西我們會很酌我們會很酌報告主席時間先暫停先暫停我們請那個三位辛苦了 三位可以先回座不過卓運長都要回座嗎"},{"start":1557.054,"end":1568.339,"text":"國務院長要回座嗎 都回座謝謝行政院 國務院長也謝謝 請回座剩下你要自己表述還是需要就我表述 我等一下表述幾個議題請大家參考那時間可以繼續"},{"start":1574.047,"end":1597.721,"text":"三位辛苦啦我想說接下來因為我這段時間對國家有一些看法我想說跟各位報告一下也請現場的各位官員能夠帶回去參考一下因為我在走訪基層的時候其實我發現了一個狀況很多人跟我說現在這個時代非常的混亂為什麼會出現這個狀況之前的官會祕書長他有提過一個他說"},{"start":1600.529,"end":1611.02,"text":"民進黨執政十年就是鬥這個字而已內鬥內 外鬥外那因為鬥下去 這樣鬥下去之後這已經超過一個民主國家政黨之間競爭的狀況了啦"},{"start":1612.85,"end":1631.536,"text":"那我總是很擔心因為我跟各位報告我一家老小全部都生活在台灣我一家老小沒有移民沒有帶雙重國籍或是綠卡我一家老小沒有所以台灣的安全台灣的未來經濟狀況什麼是我最擔心的一件事情"},{"start":1632.296,"end":1656.352,"text":"我們這段時間看到烏克蘭,看到加薩,看到伊朗我們很擔心下一個發生的地方會不會是台灣我想全台灣人,包括各位在場的官員也都這麼擔心那我覺得我現在發生了一些很痛苦的事情我覺得這個國家充滿了騙我沒有辦法接受一個國家從上到下大家都在騙人我們講第一個,剛剛我們講的關稅的部分"},{"start":1658.288,"end":1678.236,"text":"在外面談了什麼我們都能接受台灣的國際狀況我們也能理解有很多不得已的古裝但是不要回過頭來騙國人講了一個很漂亮的火花一個大內宣我們前一陣子顏惠欣過世她是一個很棒的人才她給全國人民的一個警訊原來CPTPP"},{"start":1679.625,"end":1694.654,"text":"政府對外講的非常的激動我們還要吃萊豬就是為了換CPTPP結果呢領導者就是消極的面對他多次的反應卻被霸凌那這就是騙再來預算案"},{"start":1697.25,"end":1724.896,"text":"我們在地方上一直被人家罵為什麼不審總預算當我告訴有很多甚至是高學歷的醫生什麼我跟他說那你們知不知道三讀通過的法律案法律案不願意編列預算執行他們都不知道他們都不知道他只覺得為什麼南白不審總預算那這不是又是一個騙然後這段時間綁架全國人民說新興預算沒辦法過然後會受影響"},{"start":1726.76,"end":1741.691,"text":"當我們讓薪金預算過了以後 行政院不動之那舊有的預算呢 依據預算法我們還是可以動用啊但他告訴全國人民說 都沒有錢的你來申請什麼 我都跟你說沒有那過去那段時間呢"},{"start":1743.528,"end":1767.802,"text":"預算案的解凍明明一份報告來就可以解凍結果所有的公務機關不送解凍案來私下跟我們說長官叫他不可以送後來文化部內部的文件曝光長官叫他們不可以送陸陸續續很多公務員跳出來說是長官叫他們不准送解凍案結果我們的政府繼續騙為了讓人民去受騙為了讓人民覺得大罷免要投罷免票"},{"start":1768.903,"end":1773.976,"text":"然後為了讓人民這麼做 然後騙人家說護照發不出來租屋補貼沒有 育兒津貼沒有從頭騙到尾"},{"start":1777.828,"end":1796.759,"text":"結果是什麼 明明很多預算 法定預算都可以支出依照預算法就是這麼規定 但是政府就在騙人新規預算過了 他就不動之 繼續騙人軍購案呢 明明告訴大家對沒採購我們絕對不擋 而且舉雙手贊成我們有意見的只是一些其他的國防採購對國內的採購應該回歸到正常的常規預算來審查"},{"start":1801.081,"end":1807.995,"text":"要加大審查力度結果繼續騙說你扣你的就扣你的帽子中共通路人全部都在搞這些"},{"start":1810.167,"end":1835.884,"text":"補發一萬塊一下說違憲這叫預算案違憲事實上那是法律案結果呢大家有意見之後又騙說合憲但是沒有錢然後後來又改成違憲最後呢大罷免失敗就全部發下去還要註明是行政院合法國會改革案每一個條文幾乎都是民進黨當年提的民進黨還有理想的時候提的結果我們現在提叫做國會擴權"},{"start":1838.776,"end":1857.981,"text":"這個世界上民主國家民主國會三讀通過的法律行政院就要執行但是在我們國家三讀通過的法律可以不執行就因為他不想執行憲法給你復印你就不復印都在騙從頭騙到尾印度移工明明是你"},{"start":1874.008,"end":1876.471,"text":"都是國民黨要放棄的都在騙國家什麼時候變成了從上到下都在騙國人這樣的國家該怎麼辦謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:30:50.156000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:30:55.121000+08:00","text":"謝謝院長，麻煩請行政院院長、經濟部部長及國發會主委。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T14:30:56.142000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:30:58.245000+08:00","text":"麻煩請行政院院長、經濟部部長以及國發會主委備詢。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:31:14.203000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:31:14.403000+08:00","text":"吳委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:31:15.284000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:31:16.746000+08:00","text":"三位午安，辛苦了。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:31:19.449000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:31:36.849000+08:00","text":"首先要謝謝行政院、漁業署還有航港局的協助，在今年3月核定南方澳漁港上架場的土地撥用，讓我這幾年一直爭取的宜蘭漁業發展往前跨進一步，這要先跟院長說聲謝謝。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:31:36.849000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:31:37.849000+08:00","text":"不敢當，應該的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:31:36.849000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:31:49.742000+08:00","text":"當然土地撥用是第一關，後面還有工程經費和建築進度，這才是考驗中央到底有沒有把南方澳漁民的需求放在心上，這才是重點。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:31:49.862000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:31:56.708000+08:00","text":"南方澳是宜蘭的漁業重鎮，基礎設施如果拖太久會影響到漁民的生計。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:31:56.708000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:32:17.124000+08:00","text":"上架場對一般人來講可能覺得沒什麼重要，但是對漁民來說卻非常重要，因為漁船必須定期檢查，而且必須維修，這些都需要上架場，但是現在那個地方的量能嚴重不足，這是當地漁民非常有意見的一件事，也麻煩能夠繼續支持，把這件事情做好，這部分先謝謝院長。","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:32:18.265000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:32:38.859000+08:00","text":"再來是今天的主題，「均衡臺灣」是我要談的主題，院長去年5月時在行政院官網還有臉書上提到「均衡臺灣」這個概念，國發會也有公開說明北北基宜要打造首都圈黃金廊帶，我想這個也是賴清德總統的重大政策。","quality":0.894},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:32:40.180000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:32:47.565000+08:00","text":"有關均衡臺灣，我請教院長，它的目的之一就是要促進地方就業、帶動地方發展，還有青年返鄉，是或不是？","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:32:48.686000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:32:56.453000+08:00","text":"是，增就業、提薪資、繁地方，是我們當初提出三項重要的未來檢驗指標。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:32:56.453000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:32:57.453000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:32:56.713000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:33:16.191000+08:00","text":"為了落實「均衡臺灣」，國發會在去年9月也通過了一個南科沙崙生態科學園區，還有之前的新聞稿也都有提到這些，預估年產值會有兩兆多，而且會提供3萬5,000個就業機會，再加上院長3月底宣布南科產值可以破4兆。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:33:17.212000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:33:28.283000+08:00","text":"這些願景都非常棒，我也非常支持，這總是為我們臺灣好，但是我還是要替宜蘭的鄉親問一句話：大南方有新矽谷、有3.5萬個就業機會，那我們宜蘭呢？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:33:28.764000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:33:29.484000+08:00","text":"我們宜蘭有什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:33:30.885000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:33:51.941000+08:00","text":"同樣是科學園區，我先跟3位報告一下，根據2026年3月的統計，南科的土地出租率是98.21%，銅鑼園區是71%，然後我們宜蘭70公頃的總面積，出租率卻只有40.96%，所以是連一半都不到，這是一個現實存在的問題。","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:33:52.521000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:33:58.865000+08:00","text":"院長，你們的均衡臺灣似乎忘了宜蘭也需要被大家看見、被大家照顧、被大家記得。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:34:00.486000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:34:09.610000+08:00","text":"國發會針對南科的沙崙園區，針對南部要斥資1,227億，喊出年產值達兩兆多，有三萬五千多個就業機會。","quality":0.659},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:34:10.251000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:34:18.074000+08:00","text":"宜科已經核定二十多年了，對於目前的產值目標、就業目標或招商KPI，請問院長有沒有什麼想法？","quality":0.878},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:34:18.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:34:26.198000+08:00","text":"我首先跟委員報告，均衡臺灣不是複製，不是把所有的東西都複製成一樣。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:34:26.198000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:34:31.802000+08:00","text":"比方我們在中部就是精密智慧新核心，會參酌當地多年來的發展。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:34:32.802000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:01.136000+08:00","text":"宜蘭是非常特別的，我常常在宜蘭跟鄉親們說，宜蘭未來不僅是首都圈黃金廊帶北北基宜，它甚至會跟花東的慢活城鄉連在一起，它可以吃雙頭水，不僅有科技發展，觀光、產業、文化、農業都有發展在裡面，而且宜蘭科學園區已經納入跟新竹科學園區同樣的範圍當中管理了，這是一個未來的趨勢……","quality":0.825},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:01.736000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:11.859000+08:00","text":"院長，你說這個我都認同，但是我要提的就是到底現在宜蘭科學園區的規劃是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:11.859000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:13.179000+08:00","text":"它的定位是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:13.179000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:14.520000+08:00","text":"它的產業戰略是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:15.440000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:16.641000+08:00","text":"我們完全看不到。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:17.681000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:33.529000+08:00","text":"還有一個，我繼續提一個好了，有一個興建宜科第三期標準廠房中長程個案計畫，總經費24.44億，預計118年底可以完工，這個事情我不知道三位知不知道？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:35.673000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:51.202000+08:00","text":"這整個六大產業生活圈由國發會提出，所以整個內容計畫國發會裡面有相當完整的說明，但我們是逐步推動，像桃竹苗大矽谷是第一個核定的，現在六個核定的，我們就逐步推動……","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:51.202000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:53.064000+08:00","text":"院長，您談遠了，我們就講一個最簡單……","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:53.064000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:35:54.945000+08:00","text":"委員，我……請說。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:35:54.945000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:36:31.943000+08:00","text":"委員，我跟你報告一下，我們對於宜蘭的規劃基本上有兩個方向，一個是生技科學園區，也就是我們要去發展所謂的智慧醫療，另外一個就是往觀光的部分發展，就好像剛剛院長講的，宜蘭會是吃雙頭水，一個是會接我們的首都黃金廊帶，另外一個是接花東的慢活，我們對宜蘭的建設最重要的一點就是要去開發宜蘭的交通建設，所以對於整個高鐵延伸到宜蘭，國發會是滿支持這樣的……","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:36:31.943000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:36:43.452000+08:00","text":"我再講一個，你們還是談遠了，我講一個簡單的，就是我一直希望知道，到底宜科的就業目標、招商KPI、產業價值目標、產業戰略等等是什麼，剛剛確實院長也有提到一些。","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:36:44.173000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:37:21.196000+08:00","text":"我剛剛有提到一個，第三期興建計畫這個部分，再看一下前面我剛剛講的，它原始、舊有的部分，土地出租率只有百分之四十點九多，建物部分的出租率也只有七成出頭，也就是將近三成的建物現在也沒有人承租，土地還有六成沒有人租用，但是我們現在要搞一個第三期興建計畫，當然我沒有反對第三期興建計畫，我沒有反對，但是你們有沒有把目標放在……現有的硬體已經處理好了，但是他的招商效果並不好，大家有沒有注意到這個問題……委員……","quality":0.901},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:37:21.997000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:37:24.678000+08:00","text":"因為我擔心到時候蓋出來的變蚊子館。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:37:24.678000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:37:26.819000+08:00","text":"不、不、不，委員，還是……請說。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:37:26.819000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:37:44.635000+08:00","text":"還是回答你的問題，就是整個產業要發展的話，地方的交通還是一個非常重要的因素，所以我們一直在推高鐵要延伸到宜蘭這一個部分，我們也希望這一個計畫能夠順利完成，再帶動宜蘭三科的發展。","quality":0.988},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:37:45.397000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:38:26.397000+08:00","text":"你說的這個交通我們也一直在推動，不只高鐵，還有台62線等等，很多議題，我們這段時間都一直在拜託能夠趕快處理，但是我的問題還是在這邊，因為我現在看到的是，只有建築計畫要有第三期，要蓋多少房子、要花24.44億去蓋硬體，但是我們舊有廠房以及舊有土地的出租率還是偏低，所以我剛剛拿銅鑼、其他地方的科學園區來比，別人都到百分之九十幾了，我們這邊土地出租率只有四成，建物只有七成，這個部分我並沒有看到比較有效果的招商。","quality":0.878},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:38:26.898000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:38:31.821000+08:00","text":"當然你可以講這個是國科會、竹科管理局在管的，這個不是你管的。","quality":0.852},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:38:32.181000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:38:54.528000+08:00","text":"但是我要跟各位報告，不管怎麼樣，今天在場的院長或者是部長，招商以及經濟策略一定也是你們所轄下，但是我並沒有看到這個部分，所以我想請教一個問題，既然你們有第三期廠房的個案計畫，你們有沒有思考到將來要引進什麼產業？","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:38:54.528000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:38:56.328000+08:00","text":"要創造什麼就業？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:38:56.328000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:38:58.228000+08:00","text":"要達到什麼樣的程度？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:38:58.428000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:00.409000+08:00","text":"三年內出租率要達到多少？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:00.869000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:03.129000+08:00","text":"有沒有哪個部會可以跨部會的管考？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:04.109000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:05.430000+08:00","text":"這幾個東西可不可以給我們一個數據？","quality":1},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:07.030000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:30.815000+08:00","text":"在這裡跟委員報告，就好像我剛剛跟委員報告的，我們希望宜蘭是發展所謂的生技、智慧醫療，還有一個就是觀光，所以我們其實有規劃很多，譬如在宜蘭我們會開始推動划船這部分的一些運動，就好像早上林倩綺委員也一直在推動一些水上活動。好啦！","quality":0.922},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:34.896000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:41.182000+08:00","text":"時間的關係，我知道國發會有很多想法，但是我的聚焦是在科學園區，我不是在談觀光，不是在談什麼，那個當然也是很重要，但是我還是聚焦在科學園區……","quality":0.613},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:41.182000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:42.182000+08:00","text":"報告委員……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:41.322000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:41.963000+08:00","text":"我想請問一下……","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:41.963000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:43.564000+08:00","text":"報告委員，因為……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:43.564000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:53.393000+08:00","text":"國發會認為北北基宜黃金廊帶可提供215公頃產業用地，創造11.4萬個就業機會，這個餅這麼大，請問一下宜蘭可以切多少？","quality":0.792},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:53.894000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:56.636000+08:00","text":"大概多少是屬於宜蘭這一塊？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:56.636000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:39:59.619000+08:00","text":"北北基宜四個區塊，那宜蘭大概是占多少？","quality":0.824},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:39:59.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:10.410000+08:00","text":"因為我們是做整體規劃，我們沒有辦法分一個很特定的數目字給宜蘭，我們也希望每一個地方都能夠蓬勃發展，而且是超過這個數字。","quality":0.927},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:10.551000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:18.594000+08:00","text":"你給我這個答案就是，一樣，我的質疑也是沒有錯，我並沒有聽到一個可以for宜蘭該怎麼做的答案。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:18.594000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:19.594000+08:00","text":"委員、委員、委員……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:19.495000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:23.599000+08:00","text":"你聽我說，你有整體效益，但是你沒有宜蘭的效益……","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:23.599000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:24.599000+08:00","text":"委員，產業的規劃不是說你要分哪一個數字過去……","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:24.599000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:25.599000+08:00","text":"主委，拜託先聽我說，好不好？","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:23.719000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:47.821000+08:00","text":"你有整體效益，但是沒有宜蘭的效益；你有總就業，但是我還是沒有看到宜科的就業；有總規模，但是我還是需要地方的KPI，我必須能夠論述給宜蘭的鄉親聽，我要幫政府辯護，我也要講出一個東西給他聽嘛！","quality":0.741},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:47.821000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:40:58.507000+08:00","text":"可是目前我只看到您說的整體效益，215公頃、11.4萬個就業機會，但是在地的人只問我一個：那宜科可以分多少？","quality":0.953},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:40:58.687000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:06.349000+08:00","text":"我講不出來，我只能跟他們講一個最大規模，但是個別的小部分、特定部分，我講不出來。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:06.349000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:14.592000+08:00","text":"所以我只能講，我只看到一個大餅，但是這個餅要怎麼切，我只有看到口號，也沒有KPI，這是我現在頭痛的部分。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:16.433000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:22.375000+08:00","text":"這個計畫──北北基宜，雖然把宜蘭包進來，但是在執行上面我還是看不懂宜蘭可以怎麼做。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:22.915000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:25.096000+08:00","text":"我可不可以給委員一個建議？請說。","quality":0.786},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:25.096000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:44.865000+08:00","text":"最近一、兩個禮拜以來，我碰到幾位立法院的委員，包括何欣純委員、陳素月委員，他們在跟我們談地方建設，他們都有對地方很獨特、深入的產業看法，他們提出之後，中央會跟他對接，他們不會說他說不出來、他不知道……","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:44.865000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:45.865000+08:00","text":"好，這個我等一下會講……","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:45.425000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:56.673000+08:00","text":"他都有清楚的輪廓，把中央的六大區域產業生活區加入他自己對地方的產業需求，這樣才能夠形成，我不曉得委員能不能提出你對宜蘭有什麼想法……","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:56.673000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:41:59.956000+08:00","text":"我等一下一步一步談好不好？","quality":0.083},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:41:59.956000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:42:43.040000+08:00","text":"因為我剛剛還是沒有聽到比較精確的數字跟未來的想法，所以這個部分我還是必須要提醒，畢竟現在經濟部手上還是有很多的武器，譬如說有租稅的工具、有投資服務、產創條例、中小企業數位轉型資源等等，甚至還有一個五大信賴產業的政策，我們有這些東西，所以我想請教三位，有沒有把宜科列入首都黃金廊帶裡面有關人工智慧、資安、次世代通訊等的招商節點，你們有媒合過這些廠商了嗎？","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:42:43.040000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:42:44.061000+08:00","text":"有沒有開始做這些了？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:42:45.282000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:42:54.529000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們的數位轉型補助是for所有的中小企業，有需要的我們都會協助，我們也有分區的輔導團在服務。","quality":0.809},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:42:54.709000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:43:13.574000+08:00","text":"我跟您補充一下，因為剛剛國發會提到，將來宜科的部分可能生醫或生技是很重要的重點，過去來講，生醫、生技主要是在南港及竹北，但是那邊都已經滿了，所以將來在宜科有很大的發展空間……","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:43:13.574000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:43:14.574000+08:00","text":"這部分麻煩您幫忙。","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:43:13.574000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:43:16.195000+08:00","text":"至於為什麼要有標準廠房？","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:43:16.415000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:43:20.757000+08:00","text":"因為做這些生醫科技的人，他不需要很大的坪數，也不需要自己蓋，他只需要一個空間而已，有更多的人進駐以後會形成一個聚落……","quality":0.434},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:43:25.681000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:43:54.743000+08:00","text":"部長，所以我剛剛一直說，我不反對第三期，我從來都沒有反對，我只是說前面舊有招商的部分並沒有那麼漂亮的數據，我剛剛是提這個，我也沒有反對第三期的部分，當然我知道有一些重大的產業本來就有一些特定廠房的需求，這一塊我沒有意見，但是請注意一下，舊有的廠房招商部分還是儘量協助管理局，讓他們能夠把它做好，我的目的只是這樣，我並不是來指責誰怎麼樣。","quality":0.903},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:43:55.184000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:03.010000+08:00","text":"我再請教一下，對於宜科第三期有沒有曾經開過跨部會的會議，去談目標產業跟目標廠商？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:03.630000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:03.890000+08:00","text":"有沒有曾經談過？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:05.504000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:09.425000+08:00","text":"我沒有參加，但是我相信國科會應該會有跨部會……","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:09.425000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:15.147000+08:00","text":"如果有的話，資料給我們一份，就是剛剛這兩個問題，有的話資料給我一份。","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:15.147000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:16.568000+08:00","text":"好，會後我再check一下。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:16.568000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:25.430000+08:00","text":"請問有沒有設定三年內宜科大概可以增加多少的就業機會、能夠導入多少廠商、能夠把出租率拉高到多少？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:25.791000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:26.791000+08:00","text":"有沒有這個想法？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:27.271000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:30.372000+08:00","text":"我相信一定有，我會後一併請國科會……","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:30.372000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:37.654000+08:00","text":"那就會後一併提供給我剛剛這三個問題的答案，因為相較於其他的科學園區，這個出租率真的還是稍微低了一些。","quality":0.723},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:40.535000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:44:55.604000+08:00","text":"我再請教一下，因為你們現在有推一個數位轉型補助，就是30人以下的製造業跟服務業的數位轉型培力補助，我想請問一下，目前宜蘭在地的產業有沒有人申請這個補助？","quality":0.928},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:44:57.005000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:45:13.698000+08:00","text":"我要回去check一下，但是我剛剛跟您報告過，我們會有主動的輔導團，分成四區，宜蘭在裡面，我們也會主動的……包括在地有一些工業園區或工商團體，我們都會跟他接洽，我會整理資料給您。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:45:15.219000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:45:22.443000+08:00","text":"那還是一樣再給我資料，我今天問得是比較細沒有錯，但是我現在沒有得到答案，就麻煩你們再給我資料。","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:45:22.443000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:45:23.443000+08:00","text":"沒關係，我們會後再提供。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:45:23.143000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:45:33.468000+08:00","text":"我還是希望經濟部能夠找國科會、國發會一起來討論，到底宜科三期的目標產業是什麼？","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:45:33.468000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:45:47.924000+08:00","text":"包括目標廠商、就業KPI、出租、管考等等，至少三個月內你能夠把書面給我，這樣我才能夠幫你們辯護，告訴地方的鄉親我們政府為了他們做什麼，這個再麻煩你們。","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:45:47.924000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:45:55.756000+08:00","text":"好，沒問題。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:45:55.756000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:45:56.557000+08:00","text":"算力就是國力。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:45:57.858000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:46:03.042000+08:00","text":"院長曾經提過這個，我也非常的認同，而且這是未來世界產業的走向。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:46:03.703000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:46:26.194000+08:00","text":"我在這邊跟各位報告，我還是覺得矽光子這個東西真的是宜蘭未來翻身的一個完美解方，我提幾個重點，第一個，數位服務和資安研發主要是仰賴光纖和矽光子，所以它不用再繞過交通，沒有雪隧塞車等等的問題。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:46:26.194000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:46:48.114000+08:00","text":"再來，臺北其實也比較飽和了，租金也比較昂貴，但宜蘭其實像剛剛我們說的，很多工業區的土地還是沒有租出去，所以宜蘭真的很適合作為大臺北科技廊帶數位外溢的節點，真的可以移到宜蘭去，包括後臺基地等等都可以。","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:46:48.775000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:47:04.027000+08:00","text":"還有一個，其實這是符合宜蘭人想要的環保需求，因為這些東西都是比較屬於低碳排、低污染的，針對這個部分，這是一個建議，三位不用回答，但麻煩能夠儘量幫我們去思考這個部分。","quality":0.919},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:47:05.268000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:47:44.842000+08:00","text":"再來，其實我們一直說AI是五大信賴產業，也講要均衡臺灣，所以我還是真的希望要把宜科放進去，真的給我相關的數據，我真的很希望得到，因為目前我都還沒有查到足夠的數據能夠讓我理解，我也想請各位看看，台積電在美國鳳凰城和日本熊本設廠，我看到很多例子，其實真正的招商不是蓋完廠房等廠商，很多時候是政府主動造了一個局，然後廠商就會很希望到那個地方來發展。","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:47:46.444000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:48:01.094000+08:00","text":"所以我有提幾個建議的點，當然這幾個策略也是有去詢問過相關產業，他們有給我們一些比較專業的建議，有五個，我就簡單念出來，請看一下PPT。","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:48:01.654000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:48:17.828000+08:00","text":"我們希望能夠引進一個錨點企業，不要都只是一些零星的廠商，還是必須要整個產業鏈移過去才有意義，所以我們希望能夠打包整個供應鏈，讓那邊成為一個生態系，而不是東一個、西一個零星的廠商。","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:48:19.090000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:48:37.083000+08:00","text":"其次，我們希望打造人才的工廠，希望在宜蘭推動半導體、矽光子或一些資安在地培訓的課程等等，我們需要廠商到那邊設廠，但是我們希望人才比廠商先到位，方便那些廠商，不要讓企業到了卻找不到人才。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:48:37.583000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:48:39.123000+08:00","text":"還有一個是完善生活機能。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:48:39.604000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:48:51.507000+08:00","text":"再來，還是希望中央要能夠親自造這個局，讓大家能夠過上好日子，否則宜科永遠都只是一個邊緣的園區，這是我們很擔心的一個點。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:48:53.449000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:07.009000+08:00","text":"畢竟你看矽光子的產業鏈，它已經形成那種跨企業的聯盟，有超過150個夥伴，在這個狀況之下，為什麼中央對宜科還沒有一個比較對接的地圖出來？","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:07.009000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:14.230000+08:00","text":"我一直覺得這對宜蘭來說是一個很好的機會，真的麻煩三位長官能夠多幫忙，我們來把這一塊達成。","quality":0.829},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:15.591000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:30.374000+08:00","text":"所以我還是希望國發會可以去找經濟部、國科會和宜蘭縣府，針對宜蘭園區的AI跟矽光子的招商，有沒有一個補救方案？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲：我再提一個東西，之前院長曾經公開說","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:31.113000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:36.717000+08:00","text":"你看能不能三個月內給我一個……初步的也可以，至少讓我了解一下未來的狀況，好不好？","quality":0.914},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:38.378000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:46.564000+08:00","text":"這個部分跟委員報告，臺灣不是每一個地方都適合蓋晶圓廠，因為蓋晶圓廠有土地的需要……","quality":0.865},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:46.564000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:47.564000+08:00","text":"當然，這個我接受。","quality":0},{"speaker":"葉主任委員俊顯","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:46.684000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:47.385000+08:00","text":"對，所以可能會綜合評估啦！","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:50.867000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:49:55.969000+08:00","text":"所以我說我要的是評估，並不是要你做這件事，我的立場是這樣。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:49:55.969000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:50:07.574000+08:00","text":"我不是不講理的人，但就是麻煩你們要給我一個評估，看看有沒有什麼補救方案，不行的話，我們就告訴人民，客觀上不行；可以的話，我們就儘量做到，這是我的一個想法。","quality":0.985},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:50:07.994000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:50:18.258000+08:00","text":"我還是希望了解，到底宜科在首都圈的黃金廊帶能扮演什麼樣的角色，還有未來宜蘭的年輕人能做什麼。","quality":0.86},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:50:18.938000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:50:33.310000+08:00","text":"因為我現在不能要求這些年輕人留在宜蘭是靠他的熱忱，或是拿他的未來賭賭看在宜蘭有沒有機會，我不希望他們留在宜蘭是這樣，我希望他們覺得留在宜蘭是有尊嚴的，對未來是有希望的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:50:34.691000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:50:50.338000+08:00","text":"下一個是一個老問題，我在3月3號總質詢有提出兩個東西要麻煩行政院回復，回復的結果並不能夠釋疑我懷疑的一些點。","quality":0.837},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:50:51.519000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:51:03.383000+08:00","text":"第一個、我們在談臺美對等貿易協議，這是老問題了，即ART的部分，我一直提到一點，如果當美國違反的時候，因為這是一個雙向條款，對不對？","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:51:04.223000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:51:05.864000+08:00","text":"如果美國違反這個雙向條款，我們能怎麼做？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:51:06.604000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:51:23.367000+08:00","text":"我當時問出這個問題，也講出條文，結果行政院就把條文抄一抄再回給我，可是我當時質詢已經把條文講完了，我並不是要跟你們要條文，我只是問萬一發生這個狀況，臺灣好像吃虧了，政府反制的SOP是什麼？","quality":0.965},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:51:23.367000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:51:31.973000+08:00","text":"但是我沒有拿到，所以這個部分我希望行政院還是能夠回復給我，因為所有的企業都要看這個狀況。","quality":0.927},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:51:32.233000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:51:39.740000+08:00","text":"美國的任何一個作為，臺灣都可能有企業會受影響，是不是可以把SOP、啟動的流程要怎麼做公開？","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:51:40.260000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:51:45.725000+08:00","text":"你談「對等」這兩個字的時候，你要怎麼做，必須公告給國內的產業界知道，這個東西麻煩必須告訴我。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:51:50.520000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:09.156000+08:00","text":"譬如美國現在已經對我們啟動301調查，我們要怎麼樣回應等等，將來如果有不對等的狀況發生，經貿辦公室是不是要先啟動調查、蒐集情報提報行政院，再由財政部或經濟部做一些相關的反制措施？","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:09.677000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:10.398000+08:00","text":"是不是有這個流程？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:10.758000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:11.739000+08:00","text":"麻煩行政院給我。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:12.079000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:15.961000+08:00","text":"上一次質詢我已經有提過，但是並沒有得到回復。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:16.661000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:18.102000+08:00","text":"院長，這部分再麻煩你。","quality":1},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:18.842000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:21.524000+08:00","text":"301的調查，美國不是針對臺灣，而是對世界上各個國家……","quality":0.762},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:22.024000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:22.324000+08:00","text":"我剛剛是舉例，不是問301。","quality":0.444},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:22.324000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:43.756000+08:00","text":"4月28號會開始進行強迫勞動的公聽會，5月5號會進行產能過量的公聽會，公聽會結束之後的7天內，我們就可以把我們要回復或者要申訴、要強調的理由再送過去，這就是一個程序問題，目前都在程序問題當中。","quality":0.831},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:43.756000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:47.899000+08:00","text":"我再講一次，不要把話題扯遠了，我不是在問這個。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:47.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:51.041000+08:00","text":"我只是要問，如果有不對等的狀況發生，我們要怎麼啟動SOP？","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:51.041000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:52:54.723000+08:00","text":"就這樣，麻煩回復給我。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:52:54.723000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:02.590000+08:00","text":"現在正在程序當中，在程序上必須是對等，他有問、我們有答，我們也有時間來強調、重複我們的期待跟訴求。","quality":0.837},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:02.710000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:02.910000+08:00","text":"沒問題！","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:03.130000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:04.371000+08:00","text":"院長，您說的我都接受。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:04.771000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:06.853000+08:00","text":"再來就進到實質內容的問題了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:08.795000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:14.679000+08:00","text":"我還是一個簡單的要求，麻煩給我怎麼啟動運作模式就好了，我現在不是為個案，好不好？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:15.060000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:28.788000+08:00","text":"第二個、我當時有提到一點，因為你們有找智庫做了一些衝擊的評估，所以我有問你們是哪一個智庫、它的模型是什麼、它的數據是什麼、來源是什麼、情境怎麼設定？","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:29.588000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:34.731000+08:00","text":"當場也跟我說會回復給我，全文也可以給我，結果後來我什麼都沒看到。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:34.731000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:35.731000+08:00","text":"我們有回文。","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:35.191000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:41.754000+08:00","text":"那時候問還有人跟我說這個涉及智慧財產權，我回說：國家做東西，國會要求提供，哪來智慧財產權、著作權的問題？","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:41.754000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:41.954000+08:00","text":"我們有回文。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:41.954000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:53:51.496000+08:00","text":"有回文，但是我沒有看到這些資料，我到現在還不知道是哪一些智庫，我現在完全不知道！","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:53:53.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:54:12.520000+08:00","text":"更嚴重的是，很多東西我們都是從美國貿易代表署發布的事實清單才看到，譬如我們跟美國以後的相處上，美國很多車子、機械、藥品、肉品、農產品等等進到臺灣，可能是低關稅，甚至會不會是零關稅？","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:54:12.520000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:54:13.200000+08:00","text":"都有可能嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:54:14.040000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:54:22.446000+08:00","text":"但這個東西我們都不知道，雖然你們回到臺灣講得很好聽，說你們爭取到15%不疊加、232條款最優惠等等。","quality":0.854},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:54:22.586000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:54:34.473000+08:00","text":"你們講的這些沒有錯，口號都很好聽，人民也知道我們必須拿一些東西去交換，但是至少讓我們知道拿了什麼去交換，我們有什麼東西將來要因應。","quality":0.983},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:54:35.014000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:54:56.722000+08:00","text":"還有一個，譬如SSG的問題，我們是放棄SSG，將來放棄之後……本來SSG是一個農產品的安全法，進口量突然暴增，價格被打得太低，它還可以有一個額外的保護，但這個我們也都放棄了，是不是也要讓農民能夠更清楚知道這些狀況？","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:54:56.722000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:55:01.384000+08:00","text":"不然會不會以後很多問題發生了，人民才在那邊痛苦？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:55:02.404000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:55:03.684000+08:00","text":"農漁民、傳產要怎麼生活？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:55:04.084000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:55:05.485000+08:00","text":"其實這是我一直很擔心的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:55:06.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:55:17.307000+08:00","text":"所以我簡單地講，我從美國那邊的文件看到，臺灣讓美國的貨更容易進到臺灣，我看到的是這樣。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:55:17.307000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:55:35.368000+08:00","text":"然而我們的立法委員在國會本來是代表全民監督政府，結果我們現在得到的資訊，必須要自己去看美國的資料，我們國家反而是蓋起來不給大家知道，我是覺得這個不是一個民主國家該有的樣貌。","quality":0.988},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:55:36.790000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:55:44.135000+08:00","text":"很多人只是告訴人民說：我們一切都好，我們談得非常漂亮，但是內容是什麼，人民其實都不是很清楚。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:55:45.557000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:55:51.542000+08:00","text":"所以剛剛這部分麻煩一下，我提到雙向條款怎麼啟動，希望能夠回復我一下。","quality":0.774},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:55:52.002000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:02.952000+08:00","text":"第二個，智庫的名單、全文、分析模型、數據能夠給我一下，讓我來參考就好，麻煩，因為這是我在上一次總質詢就提出來請你們做的，但沒有做。","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:03.833000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:05.434000+08:00","text":"好，這邊就麻煩了，可以嗎？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:05.434000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:05.594000+08:00","text":"可以給我這兩個資料嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:07.735000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:12.217000+08:00","text":"好，如果不涉及我剛才講的他們的營業秘密的話，我們會提供給你。","quality":0.926},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:12.597000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:25.803000+08:00","text":"這放心啦，我個人對營業秘密、對國家機密，我從來不會去要這個東西，我也都跟我的辦公室同仁說，國家機密的東西不可以去要，沒有必要的情況下，不可以去要涉及國家機密的東西。","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:26.103000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:26.763000+08:00","text":"我們會衡酌、我們會衡酌。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:26.763000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:29.204000+08:00","text":"好，報告主席，時間先暫停。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:30.605000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:30.605000+08:00","text":"時間暫停。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:31.805000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:33.886000+08:00","text":"三位辛苦了，三位可以先回座。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:34.487000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:35.167000+08:00","text":"包括卓院長都要回座嗎？","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:36.354000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:37.635000+08:00","text":"都回座、都回座。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:39.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:41.917000+08:00","text":"謝謝行政院卓院長，也謝謝兩位官員，請回座。","quality":0.722},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:42.277000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:43.798000+08:00","text":"剩下你要自己表述還是需要其他？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:44.158000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:46.739000+08:00","text":"就我表述，我等一下表述幾個議題，請大家參考。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:46.739000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:47.739000+08:00","text":"卓院長和列席官員請回座。","quality":0},{"speaker":"卓院長榮泰","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:47.739000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:48.739000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:47.159000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:47.339000+08:00","text":"時間可以繼續。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:53.047000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:56:54.128000+08:00","text":"好，三位辛苦了。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:56:55.468000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:57:04.914000+08:00","text":"接下來，因為我這段時間對國家有一些看法，我想跟各位報告一下，也請現場的各位官員能夠帶回去參考一下。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:57:05.474000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:57:15.420000+08:00","text":"因為我在走訪基層的時候，其實我發現了一個狀況，很多人跟我說現在這個時代非常的混亂，為什麼會出現這個狀況？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:57:15.420000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:57:29.820000+08:00","text":"之前的國安會秘書長有提過，他說民進黨執政十年，就是「鬥」這個字而已，內鬥內、外鬥外，因為這樣鬥下去之後，這已經超過了一個民主國家政黨之間競爭的狀況了。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:57:32.010000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:57:50.516000+08:00","text":"我總是很擔心，我跟各位報告，我一家老小全部都生活在臺灣，我一家老小沒有移民，沒有雙重國籍或是綠卡，我一家老小都沒有，所以臺灣的安全、臺灣的未來、經濟狀況是我最擔心的一件事情。","quality":0.987},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:57:51.296000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:58:01.423000+08:00","text":"我們這段時間看到烏克蘭、看到加薩、看到伊朗，我們很擔心下一個發生的地方會不會是臺灣，我想全臺灣人，包括各位在場官員也都這麼擔心。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:58:03.184000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:58:11.589000+08:00","text":"其實我現在發生了一些很痛苦的事情，我覺得這國家充滿了「騙」，我沒有辦法接受一個國家從上到下大家都在騙人。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:58:13.511000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:58:27.252000+08:00","text":"第一個，剛剛我講到關稅的部分，在外面談了什麼我們都能接受，臺灣的國際狀況，我們也能理解，有很多不得已的苦衷，但是不要回過頭來騙國人，講了一個很漂亮的火花、一個大內宣。","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:58:28.832000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:58:45.109000+08:00","text":"前一陣子顏慧欣過世，他是一個很棒的人才，他給全國人民的一個警訊，原來CPTPP政府對外講得非常激動，我們還要吃萊豬就是為了換CPTPP，結果呢？","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:58:46.009000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:58:52.553000+08:00","text":"領導者就是消極的面對，他多次反映卻被霸凌，這就是「騙」。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:58:57.990000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:58:58.851000+08:00","text":"為什麼不審總預算？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:59:00.151000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:59:11.093000+08:00","text":"有很多甚至是高學歷的醫生等等，我跟他說，那你們知不知道三讀通過的法律案不願意編列預算執行，他們都不知道、他們都不知道！","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:59:11.433000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:59:17.374000+08:00","text":"他們只覺得為什麼藍白不審總預算，這不又是一個「騙」？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:59:17.374000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:59:38.209000+08:00","text":"然後這段時間，綁架全國人民，說新興預算沒辦法過，會受影響，當我們讓新興預算過了以後，行政院不動支，舊有的預算依據預算法，我們還是可以動用，但他告訴全國人民說：都沒有錢了，你來申請什麼我都跟你說沒有。","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:59:40.191000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T14:59:55.636000+08:00","text":"過去那一段時間，關於預算案的解凍，明明一份報告來就可以解凍，結果所有的公務機關不送解凍案來，私下跟我們說，長官叫他不可以送，後來文化部內部的文件曝光，長官叫他們不可以送。","quality":0.961},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T14:59:56.777000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:00:17.568000+08:00","text":"陸陸續續很多公務員跳出來說，是長官叫他們不准送解凍案，結果我們的政府繼續騙，為了讓人民受騙、為了讓人民覺得大罷免要投罷免票，為了讓人民這麼做，然後騙人家說護照發不出來、租屋補貼沒有、育兒津貼沒有，從頭騙到尾，結果是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:00:17.568000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:00:23.492000+08:00","text":"明明很多法定預算都可以支出，依照預算法就是這麼規定，但是政府就在騙人。","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:00:24.212000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:00:26.794000+08:00","text":"新興預算過了，他就不動支，繼續騙人！","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:00:27.854000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:00:28.034000+08:00","text":"軍購案呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:00:28.335000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:00:46.975000+08:00","text":"明明告訴大家對美採購，我們絕對不擋，而且舉雙手贊成，我們有意見的只是一些其他的國防採購，對國內的採購應該回歸到正常的常規預算來審查，要加大審查力度，結果繼續騙，就扣你帽子──中共同路人，全部都在搞這些。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:00:49.167000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:06.619000+08:00","text":"普發1萬塊，一下說這叫預算案，違憲，事實上那是法律案，結果大家有意見之後，又騙說合憲，但是沒有錢；後來又改成違憲，最後大罷免失敗就全部發下去，還要註明是行政院核發。","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:07.980000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:14.884000+08:00","text":"國會改革案，每一個條文幾乎都是民進黨當年提的，民進黨在還有理想的時候提的，結果我們現在提叫作國會擴權！","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:17.776000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:34.200000+08:00","text":"世界上民主國家、民主國會三讀通過的法律，行政院就要執行，但是在我們國家，三讀通過的法律可以不執行，就因為他不想執行，憲法給你覆議權，你就不覆議，都在騙！","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:34.200000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:34.420000+08:00","text":"從頭騙到尾！","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:35.100000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:54.470000+08:00","text":"印度移工明明是你願意放進來，卻騙大家是國民黨要放進來，都在騙！","quality":0.607},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:54.470000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:55.391000+08:00","text":"國家什麼時候變成了從上到下都在騙國人？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳委員宗憲","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:55.411000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:55.471000+08:00","text":"這樣的國家該怎麼辦？謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:55.971000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:57.399571+08:00","text":"謝謝，辛苦了！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T15:01:57.699571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T15:01:59.985286+08:00","text":"吳宗憲委員，謝謝你。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T15:02:00.285286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T15:02:03.142429+08:00","text":"謝謝吳宗憲委員的質詢。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-17T15:02:03.442429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-17T15:02:07.156714+08:00","text":"我們接下來請黃健豪委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}